Flying Roller
11 posts
Mar 01, 2004
11:03 AM
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Hello again guys
#1 - A few quick questions: What do broken pupils mean? Is this caused by performance or genetics - the pupil looks like a runny egg yoke.
ALSO
#2 - My original stock birds have 1 bull eye and 1 pearl eye. Some of the chicks have this as well, is this okay or a fault?
#3 Last question: I have a young hen born at the end of the season last year and I noticed that as her eyes were coloring out, they didn't go to pearl, but rather a deep orange - is this also a fault?
I know for some of you this may seem trivial, but I want to make sure I'm doing things right. Thanks so much guys!
Terry Lapointe
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Mar 01, 2004
2:03 PM
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Terry none of these are faults,in my birds though pupil placement or abnormal pupuls can give you an indication of heat or lack of but it's not a 100 0/0 either,on that orange eyed youngster were both parents pearl eye with the exception of one bull ? the odds of two pearl eyed birds throwing an orange eye is like a million to one,I don't know how the bull eye would affect that though,how bout you other guys.
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
19 posts
Mar 01, 2004
2:45 PM
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Scott, oddly enough Van Copple and I were watching my A-team fly this morning and I commented on this one blue check hen I had just moved over because she was working so hard. She is orange eyed out of two pearl eyed birds. He said no way and I showed him the bird once she came down. Bred from an individual pen. I thought it was odd too. As for bulleyes (black) I know of several guys who don't like them at all, but I am on the other side. When a bird is up in the kit rolling, it doesn't matter what color its eyes are. Bulleyes are the result of white on the head, almost always in conjunction with the pie bald factor (badges, baldheads, etc). It's the result of lack of pigment in that area. Under the window tint if you will is the true color of the eye. If a bird has one bull eye and a colored eye, under the tint will be same color as the other eye. Some of my most exciting rollers were bull eyed. Had no effect on them what so ever. And a bull eyed bird won't necessarily reproduce them. I bred from one bird with two bull eyes on an orange eyed hen and got several none bull pearl eyed birds. Sometimes you'll get a "cracked" eye which is say half of the eye is bull (dark) an the other half is colored. I think in regards to performance the only characteristic of the eye that lends anything to performance is just as Scott said, the placement and shape of the pupil tends to shed some light on what kind of performing temperment the bird has. Seems every bird I have ever raised or flew that had an egg-shaped pupil or pupil placed out of center, often towards the lower front of the eye are the hot, deep and often unstable birds.
Brian.
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Bluesman
12 posts
Mar 01, 2004
5:24 PM
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Brian.You pretty much nailed this one.I agree with you.Also you just confirmed what I had been noticing in my family of rollers.The eggshape pupil toward the lower front of the eye.Almost all of my deep,hot Rollers are this way.I breed for deep birds.Notice I didn't say unstable.haha I can,t confirm that yet but will be watching a little closer.I would appreciate any other info on what you all have to say about eye sign and things to look for as to the temperment of the bird. David Strait
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Mar 01, 2004
9:31 PM
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Brian getting an orange eye bird out of two Pearl eye birds is much more than a little odd,it's next to impossible,this doesnt hold true as far as getting pearl eye out of two orange eye birds though,I have the same situation with a bird in my old bird kit and I also breed individual,but something happened,either the hen was dirty when I paired them up or she may have gotten out for a minute,something happened though,I don't consider her legitimate out of the cock though and nor can she be and she will forever be a kitbird due to it,as for bulleye,I dont like em,I want to see the eye,but then I dont get them either,and if you saw my birds you would know why as I may get a couple of white feathers here and there on a bird but it's not often,about 95 0/0 of my birds are pearl eye.
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Bluesman
13 posts
Mar 02, 2004
4:12 AM
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Scott. I don,t know you except from what you have posted on this site but you seem to have kept the Original Birmingham Roller strain pretty much pure.Maybe you can answer a question for me.On the Pearl eye.Personally I don,t like them.I call them Eagle eyed.My loft has a bunch of them and they are some of my best Rollers.I perfer orange eyes to look at but the performance comes first.My question is: I read somewhere(or was told) that the Pearl eye was introduced into the Birmingham Roller from the Tippler to get MORE & HIGHER fly time.This is of much intrest to me as since I am breeding for deeper birds I also need to get the birds to fly somewhat higher.Not sky out but higher than what my birds fly normally.Is there any truth to this? You said that 95% of your birds had Pearl Eyes.Do you like them best to look at or have you found them to be the better performers?Thanks,David
Last Edited by Bluesman on Mar 02, 2004 4:15 AM
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Mar 02, 2004
8:21 AM
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Good post Dave, Dave the way that I understand it is that there are a lot of questions as to the development of the breed and there are alot of old wives tales,I'm just assuming here on this one but I think that the Tippler thing derived from the "Amercan Roller" which was bred to fly high and long and was pearl eye,maybe some old timers could post in on that,Dave I get good ones in both orange eye and pearl eye but mostly in pearl eye which only stands to reason due to the pearl eye dominates my loft,but I will stock either as I want my birds to follow the roll,as long as you follow the roll your birds will show it as far as physicle consistancy's and that includes eye and feather colors,if your better birds are predominetly pearl eye and drk checks than your loft over time should be mostly pearl eye'ed dark checks and the tighter the family the more this holds true,sometimes when you head into a particular direction though things can reverse on you,it's a moving target,also there are families where orange eye are predominate as far as the good one's,or if the family is carrying a lot of white and bald heads you'll get the bull,just follow the roll and let the chips fall where they fall
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Mar 02, 2004
9:00 AM
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As far as height Dave I don't think that eye color has anything to do with it,it's more in the build and Keel and tighter or looser feather seems to play in also,with my birds I can put them into the clouds or I can put them in your face ,it's all management (well mostly there are circumstances in the atmosphere that will play in),there are some families that it's hard to get the birds out of tree top level,these seem to be the softer feathered birds,as for "mostly" pure,dave there are many lofts accross this country that have kept them "pure" and they have never allowed in a bird out of questionable lofts.
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
20 posts
Mar 02, 2004
1:43 PM
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Scott, did a little more research this morning and discovered that a little blem on the blue check orange-eyed hens band turned an 8 into a 3, or so it appeared. In otherwords she didn't come off that pearl eyed pair after all but an orange X pearl pair. Whew, I thought I was going to have to get into an arguement everytime this topic came up..lol.
Brian
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Mar 02, 2004
2:09 PM
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LOL Brian,hey I didnt say that your bird wasn't "although I was thinking it LOL " I just told you my thoughts on my bird,Brian when it comes to the genetics I'm about as ignorant as a cow turd but luckily I know people that aren't.
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Mar 02, 2004
2:12 PM
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Dave one more thing that I'd like to mention,just because a loft is pure as far as breed goes is no garantee that the birds are any good,there's a 1001 differant ways to screw these birds up.
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Bluesman
14 posts
Mar 02, 2004
3:09 PM
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Scott.If there is 1002 ways it will happen to me.Just joking.I love these little birds.Never a dull moment.Good times & Bad times.Lost my # 1 kit last week to a mink.Today my # 2 kit worked as good as my # 1 kit did.Tomorrow they will probably look worthless.I always say they don,t mess up I do.David
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Guest UseYucel Akman
Guest
May 07, 2004
11:46 PM
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I have Tipplers,some time they fly 5 minutes sometimes 1 hour sometimes 2 hours somedays half an hour.I fly my birds every morning and afternoon.Can you please tell me what to do to make them fly so high and long?I feed my birds after each flying with pigeons mix.Thanking you in advance.
Please answer my question in my e-mail address;
yucel_akman@hotmail.com
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Steve S.
Guest
May 08, 2004
8:12 AM
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Yucel,
Try this:
Fly your tipplers everyother day or make kits large enough to fly 1 kit one day and rest 1 kit while flying the other.
Switch your feed to 1/2 wheat and 1/2 milo the day you fly.
The day you rest the kit feed them white millet and when you fly them the next day your time and height will improve.
Use 1 and 1/2 cup of the above feeds per 20 birds.
Start using more millet after the time improves.
Hope this helps.
Steve
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Yucel Akman
Guest
May 08, 2004
11:14 PM
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Thanks for your advice Steve S.I will try what you have wrote and get back to you later about the resolts. I have 24 birds 14 of them flying at the moment,but my birds are mix blood,some(4)of them Father is Serbian Crested Highflier X mum is Budapest Highflier(The young ones look like I `ve seen them in the internet is exactly same as American High Flyers).You Americans call them Highflying Tipplers (I have seen the some pictures in the internet and Canadians call them Canadian high flyers).They are White in the body but flight & tail feather tips are bluish grey also beak and toe nails are same color.Eye color can be White,Pear or gravel.They are originaly from Hungary.I have sevaral diferent color tipplers, Vienna highflyers they are a bit slimmer and smaller,necks are metalic blue color and top of their heads are flatter same color as Budapest High flyers.Some pigeon fanciers told me I should keep only one type of breed and start breeding from them ,ged rid of all the rest of it.Is that true?I have been told every breeds fly differently and thats why they`re not going up and staying long in the sky.If I keep one breed would they fly higher and longer?
I want my pigeons fly so high in dots in the sky and many many hours stay up there.When I read in the internet about tipplers flying up to 23 hours,I say to my self how they do it?I will be even happy if they fly 5-6 hours you know what I mean?Before I kept Serbian high flyers only.I was told they stay up at least 5-6 hours,here in Autralia but in Europe they fly up to 15 hours. I never had one stay more than 1 hour,I was told I need a good blood I spend $100`s of dolars I`ve spend on High flyers and Tipplers,I wasn`t happy at all I ged rid off them.Now(6 months)I`ve started to enjoy with Budapest&VIENNA HIGH FLYERS I recon they are the best breeds I`ve ever had.I can fly them 2-3 times a day in any weather 365 days a year,doesn`t mater if they are hungery or full they just fly and if HAWKS or Falcons atacks they split and after gets back again into kit.I recomend anyone these breeds.If you are keeping these breeds(Budapest&VIENNA HIGH FLYERS)and would like to write(e-mail)give me more information about them(Budapest&VIENNA HIGH FLYERS ) I will be very happy.Also I would like to meet some pigeon fanciers who are interesred in same breed (Budapest&VIENNA HIGH FLYERS)in Australia/Melbourne Northern suburbs to meet can contact me by e_mail: yucel_akman@hotmail.com or my mobile 0421 897 434 Happy flying to all the pigeon fanciers.
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Tipplerman
1 post
May 12, 2004
7:41 PM
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I use to keep Rollers and Tumblers and I use to lose to many of them,because of that I have given it up.I missed their performing flyings.Now I am thinking of starting it again,but I have sevaral pigeon fanciers leaves close to me which I don`t know them and I`m afraid to loose them.
Is there a any preticular breed that I should keep or any sugestions/feeding/flying/training methods you can recommand.Thank you.
Last Edited by Tipplerman on May 12, 2004 7:42 PM
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Yucel Akman
Guest
May 14, 2004
7:30 PM
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A message to Steve S. to let you know how my pigeons are doing.
Steve I am doing what you have recommended,and if I fly them once a day, they fly one to one and half hours fist 10 to 20 minutes they fly so high and then they come down to half way and fly they they don`t go back again.
If I fly them 2 times a day after the 2 days resting they fly between half an hour to one hour each time.
At the moment I am still not happy I want them to fly at least 4-5 hours minimum flying.If anyone out there knows hoe please drop a line.Thank you.
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rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
107 posts
May 14, 2004
8:24 PM
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Tipplerman, I think you should breed Birmingham rollers. They are a tough breed, very hardy and respond well to proper training. I would get to know some of the local guys in the area and tag along to see what you can learn from them.
As to your request for suggestions: set a goal to fly a kit of 20 Birmingham rollers, get yourself 5 pairs to breed from, train their youngsters to fly for 45 to 60 minutes. Train the young birds daily if possible.
Flying rollers will do fine on a mixed grain called pigeon pop from Leech’s Milling. Fly them from a kit box large enough to hold 20 birds. (see pics on the site: Visitor Picture Gallery)
Before you buy anything, read as much as you can about what is considered a good roller. Try to visit some lofts with established fanciers, (famous names not necessary) and watch some good kits fly. Try to buy some of these. If this not possible, buy from established sources or referrals you can trust.
The most important step as discussed in my publication “How To Breed Better Rollers”, is the necessity of obtaining the best rollers possible to start your breeding system. Everything else becomes irrelevant if you do not have good stock to start.
HINT: If you choose to fly in competition, chances are that you will compete against local guys, simply see what they fly and obtain better birds. You would at least have birds of comparable quality if not better giving you the chance to do well. FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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Steve S.
Guest
May 17, 2004
10:32 AM
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Yucel,
If Tipplers are your passion here is a site that will help you in all aspects.
It is the Flying Tippler Society.
www.tipplers.com/FTSofUSA/
Hope this helps.
Steve Sissel
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