|
The Original All Roller Talk Discussion Board Archive >
Rollers YES! Politics NO!
Rollers YES! Politics NO!
Page:
1
birdman
79 posts
Nov 11, 2005
7:56 PM
|
C'mon guys, if you want to argue politics then switch on to Hannity and Colmes. It's almost as if this website has been hijacked, as every thread seems to be a continuation of the same argument over and over.
Enough is enough already. Can we get back to talking rollers instead of roller politics?
Russ
|
rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
403 posts
Nov 11, 2005
10:38 PM
|
Hey Russ, talk away old chap!
----------
FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
|
J_Star
107 posts
Nov 12, 2005
5:59 AM
|
With all I due respect, I kind of disagree with both of you on this one. If we just only talk about things that is just pigeons, for example, how high they fly, how their eating habits, how they are flying, my birds are sick!, the falcons are doing damage and so on, then this site will be very boring and soon people would not want to view it constantly. Newbie’s want to soak all the basics they can but after a year at it, they know allot. Then this site and others will not be of great interest to them because of the basics are just behind them. Then this place will be nothing but a place to brag about of how good my rollers are and in turn the arguments will start that mine are better than yours and his are better than mine. There is no end to arguments if the parties are in an argument mood.
Pigeon politics, color and any controversial issue should be discussed with each individual keeping their respect to themselves, the others and the others opinions. Each individual should know when to stop posting when they realize that the topic is just going in circles without any agreement to anything. It is just polite to do so.
Tony, I truly think that you should keep these kinds of discussions going on this site and moderate it in the background just to make sure that the fine line is not crossed. You can count the argumentive people on this site in one hand. Ask them to give you their email and keep them aside. Then privately remind them to stop or back out of the discussion smoothly so that they can save face. Keeping some kind of polite heated disccition around is a good thing. It is just like managing rollers, if you don’t breed birds with allot of heat now and then, then your rollers are not of good quality.
Jay
|
showlow
23 posts
Nov 12, 2005
6:17 AM
|
With all due respect, I use this forum for enjoyment of the sport. I think some of the people posting on this site are only doing it to argue a subject that is not going to benefit anyone but themselves. This should be a forum to ask questions,express opinions,share knowledge, and be about Roller pigeons. When people keep arguing about color birds, RD'S, and who should get to vote in whatever they are arguing about, it is not healthy for the rest of us who are aspiring to reach a higher level of breeding and flying Roller's. I live in an area where there are no other Roller fancier's, and I sure would not reccommend reading this forum to try and interest them to get started. At first it was very informative and helpful, but now has turned into forum for arguemnt and hatefilness, I think it is a shame. Tony has tried to moniter without censure, but to no or little avail. Just my opinion---
Bob
Last Edited by showlow on Nov 12, 2005 6:27 AM
|
rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
406 posts
Nov 12, 2005
6:24 AM
|
Hey Jay, sometimes people can become very myopic when presenting a point of view. They are so zealous in getting only the answers they want to hear that they ignore the intelligent answers they are given.
This approach can and does frustrate the other person along with those that follow a controversial thread.
I myself am not against controversy per se, but when the discussion goes round and round and people are being browbeaten and challenged on thier answers as if in a court of law and that they are somehow compelled through some oath to tell the truth (as they want to hear it) and nothing but the truth, i think at that point it has crossed that line.
Jay, you offered a good idea about email and taking things offline when they cross over. I will add this to the new Posting Policy.
----------
FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
|
rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
407 posts
Nov 12, 2005
6:43 AM
|
To All, this site can't be all things to all people. If people want to argue endlessly, their are pigeon lists that do welcome ANYTHING!
I prefer this site continue to be informative, family friendly and posted on by the best roller people our community has to offer.
Over the last day or two, this site has seen more than 3000 more page views daily! This is 1000 more than normal. People like to watch a fight. Controversy sells but this site is calling for your best. So BE your best. Anything less does not have a place here.
If you still don't get it, please read between the lines:
_________________________________________________
Only Your Best Is Welcome Here!
_________________________________________________
----------
FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
|
Shaun
200 posts
Nov 12, 2005
7:08 AM
|
Jay, I would agree with you to the extent that the forum needs a wide variety of topics - and, as you say, not just roller husbandry. But, what has happened with this world cup and internal politics debate, is that for a couple of weeks now the 'group dynamic' has been lost. It seems that people who play such an ongoing, active part in the usual run of issues, have been sidetracked for a fortnight, whilst they respond to the challenges put to them about US roller administration and 11 bird flies. Consequently, the forum has gone decidedly flat. At least with the likes of a colour debate or backyard v comp flyer discussion, there are sufficient numbers on both sides to take an active part. However, these recent debates which have dominated events, have involved far fewer participants.
So, long live the group dynamic.
Shaun
|
Ballrollers
187 posts
Nov 12, 2005
4:37 PM
|
Jay, I like the way you think. An open door policy on the topics is best, I believe. I have learned the most about the birds, the hobby, the organizations that represent it, the men involved, and even about myself when I am right in the midst of the most passionate debates.
Bob, I couldn't disagree with you more, and based on the numbers this site puts up in the heat of the discussions, so do many other men (and ladies). I see men, here, passionate about their point of view and in trying to be understood, but I see little real hatefulness. Scott and I come down polar opposites on many issues in the hobby. If I call it white, he'll say it's black, and vice-versa. Then the battle is on, to prove why we see it that way. Hopefully somebody reading it begins to think about things a little more, in the process. But when we got together in Denver, we were able to sit down together over a cup of coffee in the AM or a cold one in the PM, and talk rollers as friends in the sport. We all have to learn to view the insults and intimidation as debating maneuvers and poker faces and not to take them personal, which I admit can be difficult at times. Yeah, we might think it would be nice if we were always courteous and polite and sugar-coated each and every post. But, we find few lessons in life, worth learning, that are presented to us so sweetly. I believe there is something for everyone on this forum; the beginner, the new flyer, the returnee after many years,the NBRC or the WC recruit, and even the veterans in the sport. Remember, if you find a topic boring or distasteful on any given day, all you have to do is click your mouse and switch over to any of 50 other threads.
YITS Cliff
|
big al
207 posts
Nov 12, 2005
5:41 PM
|
Hi guys,
This is very important and will be my last post regarding this issue!!
You all made good points but remember, there is theory and there is reality. Open lines of discussion that allow heated dialogue and a certain amount of controversy can also be informative and useful to someone. In theory it takes all individuals involved to be able to find common ground during these type discussions, and agree to disagree.
The reality is there are people on this list from many walks of life. Many levels of understanding, many levels of communication skill, varying reasons for being motivated to post and the list goes on and on. This diversity more times than not can dictate the climate of a discussion board like this. That's why moderators are needed. Whether we like it or not it is a neccessity in this type of environment.
Tony and I discussed this matter in detail and both drew conclusions that we wanted to lean toward allowing the guys to have freedom without too much intervention. We also talked in depth about individuals I thought would be infectious to this site. For the record there were only a couple people mentioned, and I was very candid with Tony.
There are those people who are frightningly clever with their so called reasons for actions they take or things they say. These people can talk the drips off of a white three piece suit in a popsickle eating contest. If you don't have extensive experience in dealing with these type people they can feel you out, and use you for their own agenda and you won't realize it until they have begun to seriously poison, distort and pollute the climate of whatever environment you're in.
For the record, I spotted these individuals right away. Tony and I agreed to take an even more diplomatic approach in dealing with this by posting several warnings, suggestions, offering to discuss what we felt was becoming redundant and borderlining inappropriate off line. This attempt I feel was initially ignored. As a result what I predicted happened... We've had several threads on ten, again 10 seperate topics regarding this same subject matter. It's spread across this site like a computer virus while the perp is laughing and making you believe this was warranted. By anyone's standards this is unacceptable!
Please make no mistake, we have not lost control over this site! In a way it was important that everyone see what too much freedom can do when there are those who disrespect it in the name of sportsmanship. I am not going to get into the validity of the concerns that brought on this virus. They may be valid, they may not be. I don't know. I have however expressed my concerns and my intent as moderator here on more than one occassion and this is the last time as well.
NOW IT STOPS. Unless Tony fires me as moderator, I will not allow this to continue. The topic will be locked or the post deleted. (Starting tonight)
Once the obvious warning has been given and the individual/s does not comply, this person will not be able to post here. Period.
Please contact me or Tony personally with any concerns you have regarding this post as it is not open for discussion on this site anywhere at all. Please do not start another topic with this same content in mind.
Let's move on guys. A thousand people reading these posts daily to see what their heros in the hobby have to say. Give it to them like you know how! I've been doing this hobby off and on for over 20 years and still have guys I look up to and respect. Some are on this list!!
This is a great place to be. "The needs of the many out way
the needs of the few or the one" Especially when the few or one have intentions that are questionable.
Again if you have concerns contact Tony or myself off line.
Thanks for taking the time to read this post.
Now!!! Let's talk birds my friends!! :-)
See you in the roll!
Big Al
"High Plains Spinner Loft"
Last Edited by big al on Nov 13, 2005 2:13 AM
|
upcd
73 posts
Nov 16, 2005
11:54 PM
|
Good for you. It is not so bad to have some rules. More people enjoy an exciting topic and great information. Then before you know it there are more roller people having a fantasic time.
|
Post a Message
|
|
|