jord
68 posts
Apr 06, 2006
3:45 AM
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well the bird flu has hit england well scotland and i must admit im worried about it THE WIFE wants me to get rid of my rollers but thats not gona happen what would you do
JORD
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C.J.
79 posts
Apr 06, 2006
4:01 AM
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It all depends on the situation. How far from you is the case? Is anyone comingfor your birds? Was the flu found in a tame or wild bird or flock? On thing I would definitely do is monitor the health of the birds in your loft. I wouldn't jump the gun on this one.
C.J.
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C.J.
84 posts
Apr 06, 2006
6:49 AM
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Jord I would be willing to bet that it is already in the wild birds in your area. They just haven't found it. Not every bird that gets the flu dies their are those that fight and build antibodies to it. Unless it was confimed in my loft I would not lose sleep over it. When someone comes a knocking then worry. Just enjoy your birds and fly on.
C.J.
Last Edited by C.J. on Apr 06, 2006 6:51 AM
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katyroller
4 posts
Apr 06, 2006
10:35 PM
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upcd, good info. I have always believed that alot of the avian diseases that pop up are due to the lack of proper conditions at commercial facilities. I feel a large part of the problem is overcrowding. We preach to new fanciers about overcrowding. Alot of the commercial farms have too many birds so the birds are stressed and have very low immune levels, one gets sick and it turns into an epidemic before you know it. I'll pay a little more for a healthy chicken than one in questionable health.
For the guys who have alot of wire on their lofts, take a good look at wether or not wild birds are getting into your lofts. I used to have 1"x1" mesh on the front of my open breeder loft and would always find sparrows and other small birds in there. We all know about the diseases and parasites wild birds can transmit to our birds.
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C.J.
88 posts
Apr 07, 2006
8:25 AM
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I disagree that the bird flu is due to overcrowding. Thery aren't saying that every brd in the barn has it. They are destroying them in the name of controlling the flu and keeping it from spreading.I think if anything it is all of the media hype around it. It isn't necessarily hitting all of the birds in a bird farm all it takes is one bird to turn up dead in a barn and they eliminate everything. Not every bird is tested. Hell if it shows up in a sinlge bird in a farm they kill all of that farmers birds and all of the other farms birds in the surrounding area. In my opinion from reading the media is responsible for continually blowing this out of proportion. They would have all of us believe it is only a matter of time until we have a pandemic of bird flu on our hands. hell it has to jump from birds to humans first and it hasn't even mutated. I would be more concerned if it was turning up in pigs because flu's usually mutate to pigs and then humans. People act like the bird flu is something new it isn't. It has been around since the beginning of time. Majority of birds will get over it and build anti bodies to it. If it was critical wouldn't you think our wild bird stocks would be drastically lower. I live on a migratory flight path of wild birds and can tell you there is no shortage of birds. These birds winter all of the world and return to nest here and I haven't seen any ill or dead birds. The flu is out there but so are a lot of other scary sicknesses.
it would be interesting to see how many of the birds in an infected farm would actually survive if the world governments just quaranteened and treated the flu. This will never happen but it would be interesting. It is a lot like the Mad Cow Disease when it first showed up in europe well they were killing evwery single cow in the country. Now they realize how rediculious that was and when it turned up in Canada and the United states the culls were much much less. Why? because they realized that it wasn't contagious and that they were over reacting. Now Mad cow is showing up all ofver the world. In years to come if they actually take time to do some sort of study I think that they will realize that allo ft this mass slaughter of birds was a huge waste of time money and meat. Hell in some third world countries the governmet officials kill and dump the birds as soo nas they leave poor people run in and take the dead birds to feed their families. Don't you think if it was such a hell hasard you would hear of some of these individuals contracting the flu and dying. Of course you would. I think that everyone should just go on with their lives and be aware of the flu but not let it rule your life. I would be willing to bet you have a better chance of being abducted by aliens then catching the Avian Flu from your poulty or pigeons.
C.J.
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C.J.
89 posts
Apr 07, 2006
8:27 AM
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I disagree that the bird flu is due to overcrowding. Thery aren't saying that every brd in the barn has it. They are destroying them in the name of controlling the flu and keeping it from spreading.I think if anything it is all of the media hype around it. It isn't necessarily hitting all of the birds in a bird farm all it takes is one bird to turn up dead in a barn and they eliminate everything. Not every bird is tested. Hell if it shows up in a sinlge bird in a farm they kill all of that farmers birds and all of the other farms birds in the surrounding area. In my opinion from reading the media is responsible for continually blowing this out of proportion. They would have all of us believe it is only a matter of time until we have a pandemic of bird flu on our hands. hell it has to jump from birds to humans first and it hasn't even mutated. I would be more concerned if it was turning up in pigs because flu's usually mutate to pigs and then humans. People act like the bird flu is something new it isn't. It has been around since the beginning of time. Majority of birds will get over it and build anti bodies to it. If it was critical wouldn't you think our wild bird stocks would be drastically lower. I live on a migratory flight path of wild birds and can tell you there is no shortage of birds. These birds winter all of the world and return to nest here and I haven't seen any ill or dead birds. The flu is out there but so are a lot of other scary sicknesses.
it would be interesting to see how many of the birds in an infected farm would actually survive if the world governments just quaranteened and treated the flu. This will never happen but it would be interesting. It is a lot like the Mad Cow Disease when it first showed up in europe well they were killing evwery single cow in the country. Now they realize how rediculious that was and when it turned up in Canada and the United states the culls were much much less. Why? because they realized that it wasn't contagious and that they were over reacting. Now Mad cow is showing up all ofver the world. In years to come if they actually take time to do some sort of study I think that they will realize that allo ft this mass slaughter of birds was a huge waste of time money and meat. Hell in some third world countries the governmet officials kill and dump the birds as soo nas they leave poor people run in and take the dead birds to feed their families. Don't you think if it was such a hell hasard you would hear of some of these individuals contracting the flu and dying. Of course you would. I think that everyone should just go on with their lives and be aware of the flu but not let it rule your life. I would be willing to bet you have a better chance of being abducted by aliens then catching the Avian Flu from your poulty or pigeons.
C.J.
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jord
70 posts
Apr 07, 2006
9:51 AM
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lots of people who i know that keep birds say its all hype but it must be at the back of all our minds well mine atleast that one day we might have to get rid of all our birds scary thought hope it never happens
JORD
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katyroller
5 posts
Apr 07, 2006
12:01 PM
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C.J.- there have been very strong cases of bird flu being transmitted from infected birds to humans who have been diagnosed and died, fortunately not in this country. What they haven't been able to confirm is human to human transmission. I do agree that the media has played a large role in over playing the situation but I do believe bird flu could become a serious health hazard if left unchecked.
If you have a bird in your loft get sick, what do you do? I'm sure like most of us you seperate the bird and try to start some kind of treatment. You probably also start treating the other birds for the symptoms or keep them under close observation. True, not every bird will get sick because of one bird but the more birds you have in close proximity to a sick bird, the higher the chances of having an epidemic. Will bird flu ever become a serious threat in this country? I personnaly don't think so but I am just a Roller fancier. As a fancier I believe we owe it to everyone else in the sport to keep our lofts presentable and control the number of birds we keep. If your like me and don't live in the country, the prying eyes of a paranoid neighbor could put you out of business.
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
465 posts
Apr 07, 2006
12:28 PM
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Is the sky really falling?
One thing I hate is my co-workers or friends or new acquaintences, when told I raise birds, they IMMEDIATELY ask, "aren't you afraid of the bird flu?". Like oohhhh, so spooky, we are all gonna die...ohhhhh. I tell them hell no! Stop watching so much TV and do some real research.
People, if it happens, it happens. Your piddly little attempt to keep your lofts spick and span won't keep Johnny Government from cleansing your property. I've been through this with END, same thing, just a different virus with a "potentially" different result. That potential hasn't happened yet and H5N1 isn't here in the states either. If it does, so what. West Nile was supposed to be the ultimate killer that would wipe out the old and young. Hum, wonder what happened there? Did every pond owner have to drain his pond? Hype, hype, hype. Sells like maple syrup at pancake eating contest.
Just get on with your life and enjoy your birds. You will probably be more likely to get hit by a car tomorrow than infected with H5N1.
Brian.
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Shaun
335 posts
Apr 07, 2006
1:07 PM
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At the moment, with bird flu having been confirmed in Scotland, the British government's response is anything but of a panic nature. This might well be because other European countries found their own first bird flu victims within the past couple of months; it was inevitable that the British Isles would follow. However, what's encouraging is that other than isolated incidences, there has been no major outbreak, anywhere. On the national news, last night, questions were put to officials as to what the rest of the UK should do. They confirmed that there's a small zone surrounding the 'dead swan' area of Fife in Scotland. Then, just beyond that, precautions among chicken farmers and suchlike, have been stepped up. However, the official response was that it was neither necessary nor appropriate for other areas of the UK to start bringing their birds indoors.
I also have a house in France (it's only about 150 miles south of my main home near London, England). I visited it last week, for the first time since certain European countries, including France, stepped up their own internal measures to combat a possible outbreak of bird flu, each having sustained bird flu incidents. My French isn't great, but I was greeted at my house by the usual paraphenalia, which had accumulated in the letterbox, since my last visit six weeks ago. Amongst the usual advertising crap, was a stern letter from government sources. It stated that anyone keeping any form of bird livestock had to declare each and every one. The list started with the obvious chickens, ducks and geese, then followed through to pigeons and various fancy birds.
Yet the outcome of this survey was to do what? Cull them? Bring them indoors? Nah, they just wanted to know who had what. It would seem that in the event of a human threatening outbreak, there would be a knock on the door at some point. Fair enough.
Perhaps Europe is waiting with bated breath, but until humans become infected, there's no sense of panic - despite media hype. Let's not forget, that the H5N1 virus which has actually killed people has, so far, been in pretty much third world environments, where the inhabitants have their chickens in very close contact - running through the house, etc. Yet, despite these conditions, bird flu has collectively killed less people the world over, than car accidents might do on any given day.
Incidentally, whilst chickens have proven to succumb readily to the virus, other birds, including pigeons, have proved to almost shrug it off. This is clearly a good thing, given the sheer number of feral pigeons, which could cause a major panic, should H5N1 be attributed to any one of them.
So, for the time being, roller flyers are way down the hit list. If pigeons do become an issue, ferals will have to be the immediate target, given the sheer number of them which could come into human contact. Then we have racing pigeons which can travel significant distances. It's, therefore, inevitable that their weekly races would be curtailed.
So, I reckon the high profile of ferals and racing pigeons will be the litmus test for what will ultimately happen to us roller keepers. We will know some time in advance what's going to happen.
Shaun
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tapp
80 posts
Apr 07, 2006
2:16 PM
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I believe the govt. likes this shit hyped up. What I believe is that they like throwing this scare in because eventually they want to control everything. From the individual turkey farms, chicken farms, cattle, and swine. They don't want the individual to raise anything on their own and a scare like this gives them an excuse to kill all the chicken, turkeys, cattle, etc. When they get just a select few that raises these animals then it is ten times easier to control that handful. The govt loves to scare the uninformed and uneducated in animal husbandry. The cities are full of them (stupid people) that will run out and buy the rubber clothes and gloves. They out vote us ten to one at the ballots. What does this have to do with pigeons? EVERYTHING!!! Because once they (govt.) get their foot in the door, it will even be your parakeets in your house! Remember going to the mill and there would be fifty to sixty different farmers waiting to unload feed. Nowadays, just a few big farmers are left.
I don't have a solution. I wish I could come up with one. I just know that sooner or later it will just be a few big farmers, a few big turkey/chicken farms. We need to stick together and oppose some of these ridiculous laws they keep coming up with year after year. It's getting so that curling up in the fetal position, sucking the thumb and taking it in the a-- is the American way. Just be sure to vote and keep flying!!!!!!
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Tapp
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nicksiders
509 posts
Apr 07, 2006
2:42 PM
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Don't let migrating birds or birds that migrate mingle with your pigeons. Our breed should not have problems. We fly them out of a box and they land and go back into the same box. Our breeders don't go outside.............I think we a pretty darn safe.
Long distant flying racers may have a problem.....I don't know
I agree with BMC.....I may get the desease or I may not; so be it. I am not going to step out in front of a speeding bus, but I am still going to cross the street.
Last Edited by nicksiders on Apr 07, 2006 2:43 PM
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C.J.
99 posts
Apr 09, 2006
5:49 AM
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As I Was saying in an earlier post. There are people in poorer countries who instead of handing their birds over killed and ate them without contracting it. There are also situations where extremely poor people raid the dump sites and take the culled chickens home to eat. Scientists have also went on the record to say that even if a chicken you were eating had it is cooked properly you are in no danger.
C.J.
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STARFIRE
29 posts
Apr 09, 2006
12:46 PM
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Hey Guys;
Calm down. I don't think the avian flu effects pigeons.
Iv'e never heard of pigeons being culled because of it.Have you?
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STARFIRE
Stan Arnold
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C.J.
100 posts
Apr 09, 2006
6:03 PM
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Hey Stan Why wouldn't it affect pigeons.
If you remember last summer some homers from right here in Canada were shipped to Australia. Once there the authorities tested them and found that some of the birds had the antibodies for a strain of avian flu. Which meant that they had the flu but over came it. Not to attack you personally but everytime something bad or undesireable happens everyone starts saying our beloved birds aren't carriers or it doesn't happen to pigeons. People need to keep in mind that if it truly didn't affect our birds then wouldn't researchers use them to find out why. You can bet you loft on it. They would be studying pigeons to see what makes their immune system resist. Pigeons are suseptible to tons of diseases why would this one be any different. I think whay people need is to be aware that the flu is out there but not lose any sleep over it. All we can do is try our best if it comes we will deal with it. After all the poultry farmers have a lot more to lose than we do and they haven't been able to avoid it. Just enjoy your birds to the fullest.
C.J.
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STARFIRE
31 posts
Apr 09, 2006
6:15 PM
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CJ;
The birds you're talking about did not carry the deadly n5h1 virus that everyone is worried about.I don't think they even culled those birds because the were no threat to anything.
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STARFIRE
Stan Arnold
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C.J.
101 posts
Apr 09, 2006
6:25 PM
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Stan you are right they weren't carrying anything at the time but the did have a strain of avian flu at one time. This shows that they do indeed have a sustibility to the flu among other diseases.
C.J.
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STARFIRE
33 posts
Apr 09, 2006
6:44 PM
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CJ'
What are you trying to say?The flu strain they had was harmless .Thats why I said pigeons did'nt get the deadly strain yet.End of story.
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STARFIRE
Stan Arnold
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C.J.
104 posts
Apr 10, 2006
5:55 AM
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Ah Stan there is the key word, Yet. My argument was you said it didn't affect pigeons. now you add the word Yet and with this I agree. It hasn't affected pigeons Yet not it won't or it doesn't it just hasn't Yet.
C.J.
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katyroller
7 posts
Apr 10, 2006
6:12 AM
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Stan, what C.J. is saying is that the test results did not show the birds actively carrying the virus at the time they were tested but due to the antibodies that were found it was obvious that they had been infected with an avian flu virus at some point of time. To clarify my earlier posts, I am not suggesting that we need to be stressed out over our birds getting sick but that we need to ensure that we practice preventative measures. I personally believe pigeons are susceptible to this disease. Last year a pigeon peddler in I believe Turkey died from the virus and investigation results were pointing toward the pigeons he was selling. If we properly feed, house and observe our birds, we won't have much to worry about.
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