Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
615 posts
May 18, 2006
8:17 PM
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To All, for the forseeable future, at my discretion, the posting privileges of any member will now be immediately suspended when that member willfully violates the Posting Policy.
ALSO...
New membership to the All Roller Talk forum is temporarily on hold until a new method of new member acceptance has been worked out.
If you have ideas, I'm listening...
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
ATTENTION ATTENTION ATTENTION ATTENTION
Buy Roller Pigeon Products On This Site: Reading Materials, Shipping Boxes, Leg Bands, Egg Candler, Nest Bowls, Kit Flags, Catch Nets, Roller Pigeons, Vitamins/Electrolytes and Medications; More Coming!
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motherlodelofts
779 posts
May 18, 2006
9:54 PM
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Tony , I think sponsership is a great way to go, plus helps keep out the animal rights whacos and rift raf.
I'm on a couple of lists and none are open to the public at large and yet new guys find thier way on sooner or later just by making contacts.
Another thing is this hidden identity stuff has to go, if you are going to post at least be man enough to give your name.
Scott
Last Edited by motherlodelofts on May 18, 2006 9:55 PM
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Velo99
428 posts
May 19, 2006
5:01 AM
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Yeah! What Scott said!
And I know Scott`s real name!
v99rnhkennytrp
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Ballrollers
367 posts
May 19, 2006
6:29 AM
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I gotta agree with Scott and Kenny.
YITS, Cliff
Last Edited by Ballrollers on May 19, 2006 6:29 AM
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Alan Bliven
331 posts
May 19, 2006
7:20 AM
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Does this forum have an option for "Moderation?" Moderation is where a moderator reads every post before it's allowed in the forum. They can either approve or deny each post. It's a very nice option.
I wouldn't allow any inflammatory posts, swearing, trolls etc. and that goes for the "big shots" as well. You have to be careful and can't play favorites. Sometimes a regular member will provoke someone he don't like and then when he responds in an inflammatory way, the regular member points fingers at him to make him look bad.
Trolls chase away the good guys and in time you'll have only the bad apples left. The answer is to get rid of them before they get their foot in the door.
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Alan
Last Edited by Alan Bliven on May 19, 2006 7:27 AM
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J_Star
438 posts
May 19, 2006
8:54 AM
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That is when I step in Allen. It happened in the past and I was able to stop it before it went any further many times. That is because the majority of the members are level headed and respectful. Sometimes they get carried away but they know when to stop.
Usually the problem is with the new people. They caused enough trouble on other sites and they lost their welcome. Then they come here to stir shit and they know it. That is what they do best. Look at the number of posts they posted at this site and you will know that they are new to the site. If I was new at any site, first I want to meet everybody before I ruffle any feathers. But they want to ruffle feathers regardless. Those type of characters are best somewhere else.
Jay
Last Edited by J_Star on May 19, 2006 8:57 AM
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Bluesman
Pigeon Fancier
743 posts
May 19, 2006
10:48 AM
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I also agree with Scott. David
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C.J.
163 posts
May 19, 2006
12:38 PM
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I would hate to see this site resort to only a select few. I thin that the newbies who actually are legit also help make this site what it is. If you can only be on here with a referral or approval then a lot of people will not be on here. I have come to this site for years and would not meet the criteria to come on here if I needed a referral from someone on this site. Why? Because I live in North central Ontario and most of you live in the states. Does this mean I have nothing of value to contribute ahhh no. So just because someone is recommended for membership doesn't mean they are the only ones of value out there. There have been way more positive posts by newbies than negative ones. Don't let a few bad ones ruin it for everyone. No matter what security you put in place some moron is always going to manage to sneak through. Some of the problem here is guys get on here and actually encourage them to talk. When we had spinnerdom here all he did was spout stupid stuff and many here krept on humouring him. This lead to more and moree postws from this guy. I think what is needed here is a system where guys who are on here all the time moderate the site. They have the control and power to immediately delete crap from here or delete memberships after three warnings. There should also be a tab that if someoner on here sees something they can clik on it and report the infraction to a moderator. I am not just talking about one moderator I am talking about a half dozen or more guys who have proven that they have the best interest of the hobby and this site in mind. My warning to you Tony is if you get to sticky on who can join this site just because of who they know you are going to lose the true thing that makes this site interesting. If a single guy out there who has raised rollers for along time such as myself with twenty six or more years under my belt feels that only us long timers have made this site then we need to get our heads out of the clouds. It is also the new guys looking for help that give us food for thought.
C.J.
P.S. Tony everyday you keep the new membership locked down you are losing potential customers and new hobbiest so I hope you solve this quickly.
Last Edited by C.J. on May 20, 2006 6:25 AM
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Alan Bliven
332 posts
May 19, 2006
3:25 PM
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Limiting it to sponsors will ruin the site and hurt Tony's advertising of his products. Having it open to everyone that behaves, sponsor or not, pulls in people that will be exposed to Tony's products and in time most will likely buy something.
A diversity of opinions and debates should be allowed as long as the posts are civil. You don't want some exclusive club like some where you have to think like the host in every way. That wouldn't be good for Tony's business but Trolls should be kept out whether they are sponsors or the big shots.
I do believe it's a good idea for everyone to show their real name. It takes the hypocrisy out of it. Forums attract punks who act big and tough while hiding behind their monitor in their underwear. If they show their real name, it takes away that hypocrisy. We should all be responsible for what we say.
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Alan
Last Edited by Alan Bliven on May 19, 2006 3:27 PM
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motherlodelofts
780 posts
May 19, 2006
5:59 PM
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Who do you consider the trolls Allan ?
Scott
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Alan Bliven
333 posts
May 19, 2006
8:01 PM
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In Internet terminology, a troll is someone who comes into an established community such as an online discussion forum, and posts inflammatory, rude or offensive messages designed to intentionally annoy and antagonize the existing members or disrupt the flow of discussion as their only purpose.
You fill in the names.
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Alan
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Ballrollers
368 posts
May 19, 2006
8:02 PM
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Scott,
Internet trolls are people who "troll" the sites with nothing really substantive to offer the conversation. They delight, primarily, in antagonism, anonymity, name-calling, profanity, controversy and basically stirring up trouble, talking in circles, etc. Sounds familiar, huh?! YITS,Cliff
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Alan Bliven
334 posts
May 19, 2006
8:10 PM
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I guess we need to ask ourself, does the shoe fit?
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Alan
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viper
18 posts
May 20, 2006
6:03 AM
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I think they need to post their names but not some made up one.Give them a trial to see what happens.Blake
Last Edited by viper on May 20, 2006 6:05 AM
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C.J.
166 posts
May 20, 2006
6:24 AM
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Who is going to verify that it their real name?
Hell Osama could post here and use a different name. Who is going to be responsible for verifying everyones name. If you say Tony then you have just made this site atleast maybe even two full time jobs. Then you have to ask your self is the problem that bad. I have been on sites where hackers and trolls have actually shut down sites. This site to me atleast seems to have a very minor problem in Comparison.
I've sais it one and I will say it again put on more moderators. J Star has helped clean up this site and I thank him for it but it will be even better if there is more people out there keeping watch. Kind of like your American minute men . They can help in a moments notice.
Cory Joseph or how I prefer to be known as
C.J.
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motherlodelofts
781 posts
May 20, 2006
10:21 AM
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I guess we need to ask ourself, does the shoe fit?
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Alan
Well dip me in sheep shit Alan , I think I am doing it now.
Scott
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knaylor
202 posts
May 20, 2006
11:14 PM
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Guys, i look at it like this..... This is a great roller site that is here for learning and discussion. Correct? Who would take someone seriously and even take advise from that would not post who they are. I know I dont. Kevin
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JMUrbon
6 posts
May 21, 2006
7:43 PM
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I have to agree with Kevin on this one. I am not in this site on a regular basis and I dont come here to find out how to fly rollers. I feel every one has their opinion on how to do that and by asking that question it as almost certain to bring out the (Trolls). opinions are a dime a dozen and as soon as everybode realizes that they are just that " an opinion" than the bickering will end. The descent breeders on this list know who they are and generally give good sound advise. But the advise is mearely a method that has worked for them and may not for evryone else. I think that Jays method by looking at the number of posts is very biased and not an accurate method of policing this site. I do think that the sponsorship method is far better because you wouldn't sponsor somebody with your name on the line if you didn't know who they were. At least I wouldn't. Joe
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tapp
89 posts
May 21, 2006
8:06 PM
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I'm glad I didn't have to know somone to come on this site.Iv'e learned years worth of info from reading these post. We all had to start somwhere. a lot of you knew some one with rollers somone to talk rollers with. know matter how silly a question is its not silly to the guy asking or he wouldn't ask. You've got to have some common sence and sort out the BULL---- post, after awhile you see the crap keep posting then kick them off. maybe my post is crap and Tony will kick me off!!!!! Best learning is get out breed and fly and cull the crap out of them. year after year!
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Tapp
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J_Star
440 posts
May 22, 2006
4:59 AM
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From my experience, most of the time people who start with this nonsense are new comers. Not newbies to the hobby, rather people who thinks they are the roller god who knows it all and no one else matches their status. Is that true all the time? No. But I have been on this site for a long time to make an analysis based on what I have observed. I look at the number of your posts, Joe Urban, which are low and that because you dropped long ago and now you are back with us. That does not put you in that category. We all know you from the first time you started on this site and besides, your logon id says your name and allot of people here know you personally very well and yet to hear anybody say anything negative things about you.
Sometime hostility stars because people have strong opinions. Those people could be the best of friends but they like to clash over stupid things, which is kind of ok but not desired and name calling is demeaning, no matter how it is said and we all should refrain at all times from going there. Remember that our writings show our character and personality for those people who are a world away. Most of the time, I can determine the problem personalities by their way of writing and responding to posts. When we are not sure of those individual actions, an email offline goes out for that individual to tone down his responses and keep things civil. Some acknowledges and correct their actions while others won’t give a hoot. Those individual will get booted.
All what Tony and I ask is please keep the peace and make this site for all to enjoy and feel welcome. We appreciate all your participation folks and your support. Let us play clean ball and have fun. This is what this hobby all about. Isn’t it?
Jay
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JMUrbon
7 posts
May 22, 2006
4:07 PM
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I have to agree with you Jay and you are exactly correct on the way you can read a persons post and get a pretty good idea as to weather they are looking for an argument or just stressing their opinion. I didnt rite that post about me in regards to the low number of posts because I am not usually one to get involved in an agumant that has no value to it. I had not been able to post to this site for quite some time and thanks to Tony's help and guidance I was able to get back on. I still say Jay that the sponsorship is not a bad idea and one that works in other places quite well. Joe
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smk
2 posts
May 24, 2006
5:24 PM
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I don't often chime in on here but don't you think limiting access is a little on the commie side. I believe the best way to defuse the trolls is not to respond to them if they can't stir up anything they don't get any pleasure from it. just my 2 cents
smk
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C.J.
183 posts
May 25, 2006
4:14 AM
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I have to agree with smk
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motherlodelofts
787 posts
May 25, 2006
5:02 PM
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On a second thought , I think this list serves well for attracting new flyers and limiting access would be a mistake.
I think it is better to deal with problems on a one on one basis as they arise , but on the same hand they need to give us thier names if they want to post
Scott
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RenaB
2 posts
May 25, 2006
9:10 PM
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I only use this site to find owners of found Rollers I am with 911PigeonAlert no I am not a animal rights activist just a Modena, Racing Homers, Frillbacks and K Tumblers and sometime Roller breeder and exhibitor. I agree with A. B. you guys should have a Moderator. I love to watch Rollers they were my first breed 40 years ago, I also like reading about them, you should let new members on board without having to be invited or referred, for your hobbys sake new flyers. Just my opinion!
Last Edited by RenaB on May 25, 2006 9:13 PM
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J_Star
444 posts
May 26, 2006
8:12 AM
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I like the sponsorship idea and I don't at the same time. For those newbies who wants to belong to a forum and who don't know of others to sponsor them, then they are locked out. If this forum is geared towered helping others, and in particular the newbies, then sponsorship won't work for their advantage.
I personally believe in the warning system. A person will get one warning email to correct an action. There will be no second time to be warned. The regular participants know better to engage into a pissing match that leads to nowhere, and I think they should be asked to refrain from participating in such an argument due to their time in the forum but that doesn't mean they can and will be warned on a continuous basis. The final say is Tony's and I am sure he will make the correct one.
Jay
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fhtfire
452 posts
May 26, 2006
9:54 AM
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Why does everyone have there feathers so ruffled!!! Like Scott says..deal on an individual basis. That is why we have a moderator...There is nothing bad on this forum...that I have seen....just some bickering...if bickering was an issue...helll....I would not be married LOL!!! I think you do not try and fix something that is not broken. What makes this site a good site...is that you can speak your mind and you do not need a special invite. Look at the amount of post...or pages...to the amount of lug nuts that come on the site and mess things up. It does not happen to often. THere are enough old timers on this site...to put a stop to the nonsense and plus...it never last to long....and if you get your feelings hurt by someone typing on a computer...miles away....then you are a lug nut too...lol...the cool thing about not wanting to hear BS on a site...is to not read it or just not enter that discussion. LEAVE WELL ENOUGH ALONE>>>IT IS NOT BROKEN>>>>WHAT WE WITNESS HERE>>>IS WHAT HAPPENS>>>>>ANYTIME>>>YOU GET DIFFERENT PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT A SUBJECT>>>>>NOTHING NEW!!!
rock and ROLL
Paul
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RenaB
4 posts
Jul 26, 2006
12:41 PM
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Hi, I have now aquired 5 Rollers through people who have found them and no one claimed them so I guess I now breed them beside 6 other breeds! All of them are real little in size except a baldhead BCK I just got yesterday with a OHIO band. Its a meduium sized Roller. Is there a difference and can you tell a good spinner by their size and body structure? I cant wait to see them fly and that will be a long time so they won't take off. Any information appreciated. Rena
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J_Star
544 posts
Jul 26, 2006
12:53 PM
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Rena,
There is no difference really. Some are long cast, some are short anc compact while others might be a bit larger. Most of the cocks are larger than the hens. Size really don't effect perfomance, but I prefer the smaller size rollers.
Any way, just tape their wings with electrical tape. Spread the wing open and grab the last five or six feather tied together and then put a tape to hold them. Electrical tap is heavey so just put it on one wing. If you use masking tape, use the yellow kind and tape both wings. After a few days let them out about the yard and they will become comfortable with the surrounding. In couple of weeks they will be ready to fly.
Jay
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nodoze
3 posts
Jul 30, 2006
9:02 PM
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Tony, I have been reading post on this site for some time now and think it to be one of the best learning tools that someone new to BR could possiblyuse outside of a personal mentor. This is one great site and you should be proud of what you have created here. I have sat back and not said much until now because of what I have read here on this post. It has been mentioned that we should look at the number of post someone has made or that maybe start having limited access to postings to keep away trolls and trouble makers. While I can appreciate some concern to this issue, there are some of us that very much enjoy this site and like me maybe only post once in awhile if ever. I would hope just because some of us are unknown or new that we would not be penalized by others actions. I personaly think this is the greatest BR forum that I have had the pleasure to enjoy and hope you keep up the outstanding work. I also think that the regular guys have a big round of applause coming to them for without them this site would not be what it is. Just my thoughts
Bobby
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Proof Is In The Air!!!!!!!
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C.J.
511 posts
Jul 31, 2006
6:03 AM
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Hey nodoze all of the advice such as look at the number of posts or new guys should have sponsors are just that advice. Tony now has a few things in place to keep the trolls out. One such security measure is site moderators. No one will be judged because of the number of posts they do or do not have. It doesn't matter if a person has four or four hundred posts if they break the site policy they will be dealt with in the same manner. So I hope you enjoy the site and learn tons. The guys on here are some of the best in the world.
C.J.
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nodoze
4 posts
Jul 31, 2006
9:05 AM
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Thanks CJ. I think this is one great site and compared to other sites I have visited, it is a A+ rating
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Proof Is In The Air!!!!!!!
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