Santandercol
123 posts
Jun 23, 2006
5:39 PM
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Oye,
I have 5 young birds in one kitbox,which have been flying for 2 weeks now,already doing flips and riding their tails.Up till today,I was catching them on their perch and tossing them out.Finally found the red and white canuck flag lost in the workshop so decided to try flagging them out of the box.Man,,by the time I had the door shut and the trap open,they were no where to be seen.Must have dropped into the trees immediately.2 of them came in 20 minutes later and one is still sitting in the same spot she landed on the wire out front 5 hours ago, where she's never landed before.Hoping the other 2 show soon,but they sure got scared --itless when I used that flag.Anybody had that kind of experience before? and did the birds get used to the flag??----------
Kelly
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
665 posts
Jun 23, 2006
5:59 PM
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Hello Kel, I have not had what you described ever happen to me. I use the flag every time I release my kit. Within seconds they are all out and starting to kit right away.
In the past, when I had to use my hat or some paper feed sack or something to shoo them out of the kit box I always wished I had some sort of flag to wave at them and at least feel and look a little "professional". LOL
Here is a video of me using a kit flag just like the one we sell here on the site: Tony Using Kit Flag
If you continue to have problems, have your team watch the video and practice! LOL
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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motherlodelofts
814 posts
Jun 23, 2006
6:11 PM
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Use a stick, its not quite so scary to em LOL , I use a broom handle
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Santandercol
124 posts
Jun 23, 2006
9:32 PM
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Yeah,can't believe it!!Those last two still haven't come in.Hijo de puta.But,,,poor buggers.Don't know for sure about your advice on the video Ton,but think I'll go for the broomhandle trick eh Muddaload,put that on vid maybe can sell!!!!
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Kelly
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Santandercol
125 posts
Jun 24, 2006
6:49 AM
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Thanks Scott,
I won't be using that flag again.Still missing the 2 next morning.
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Kelly
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
666 posts
Jun 24, 2006
8:39 AM
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Hey Scott, well you can use anything you want. I’ve tried everything from, hats, sticks, empty feed bags, newspaper rolls, footballs and I found what works for me and my birds is the flag.
Remember, a flag, or a stick or your hat, when properly used is all just a “trigger” initiating a conditioned response you set for them.
The reason I prefer the flag is that it immediately gets the attention I want from my birds either in the kit box or especially those youngsters in training that want to land before they are tired.
When some of those young birds see the flag wave and that flapping flag sound: BAM, they are off flying for another 5 minutes. This is very practical when I am getting young birds conditioned to fly 20, 30 and 40 minutes.
Plus, my birds tend to be calm, not taken to being agitated by a crumpled paper bag thrown across the yard or a stick being waved at them, I hear them now…like “oh, yeah, he’s got a stick, ooohhh…scary”. LOL
Like with feed, there are nuanced ways to use a flag to get what you want. Too much and the birds can over react creating another problem, not enough and they don’t do what you want them to.
Like I said, I have tried all types of devices to encourage young birds into the air and keep them flying longer so they can become better conditioned. I would say a flag can definitely help create good habits AND prevent bad ones, i.e. when a young bird wants to land too early, often pulling down another one or two.
AND, I have NEVER lost a bird using a flag. I have to winds, flying too late in the afternoon, preds, bumping, overfeeding, illness, thieves. Hmmm, Santandercol, you got your work cut out for you! LOL
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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rosebudrollers
19 posts
Jun 24, 2006
9:22 AM
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It has been my experiance that birds kept in protected quite enviroment often wig out when flagged.I often play a radio fairly loud in the loft or near the birds.My birds are very calm and easily handled or flagged with anything.PS they like country music... Curtis
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
667 posts
Jun 24, 2006
9:51 AM
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Hey Curtis, help me out with something, you said your birds are calm and can be flagged with anything, in my way of thinking about it, if a bird is flagged with anything, then its not a calm bird.
I have birds so calm on the perch, I still have to scoot them out of the kit box with the flag. That to me is calm.
I also have a sub-group in my family of rollers, so UN-calm that when I so much as look at them they want to kick my a$$. LOL
I open the kit door, these are the first ones out, they need little encouragement except of the subtlest kind.
Look, your birds will respond to thier conditioning. If Santandercol had his birds all over and some still missing it is because he used a tool that was for all intense and purposes a falcon as far as his rollers were concerned.
A tool like this has to be used properly and an understanding of the upsides and potential downsides is needed. Rollers are human-friendly creatures and will respond wonderfully to proper and breed consistent training.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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rosebudrollers
20 posts
Jun 24, 2006
10:20 AM
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Tony, I meant that my birds do not react wildly to any flagging object,but they will go when signaled.They never seem to panic and I think it might be a result of their enviornment.I run the weed eater and mower right by them and they pay them no mind.Plenty of noise around here.I think they are a lot like babbies and adapt to their surroundings.This may not be roller correct but it seems to work for me.Curtis
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
669 posts
Jun 24, 2006
10:25 AM
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Hey Curtis, I see what you mean now. I too make noise with my mower, bump the kit box and stuff like that. One of my shepards will actually run around underneath the kit as if herding them. When they land and if any go to ground, he will chase the one off the ground and the others on the kit box will just ignore him.
Proper conditioning and acclimation to the environment is critical to good results. Thanks!
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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Santandercol
127 posts
Jun 24, 2006
10:31 AM
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Tony,
Yeah,their reaction was exactly as if a hawk or falcon had attacked.You'd think those last missing two would come back tho'.I guess maybe they went into the trees to hard and could be hurt.Think I'll go take a survey around the neighbours yards and see if I can find them.
Kel.
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Velo99
508 posts
Jun 24, 2006
2:26 PM
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With my y/b`s I just open the door and wait a few minutes. Then I`ll clap my hands . After that I go over and stick my arm in the trap and kinda swoosh em out.
Usually the first five go out pretty quick. Then next group is 7-8 birds a minute or two later. Then there are like 5 or so that I have to physically remove. Some I hold in hand and walk around the yard and give him a pep talk. Makes me feel better anyway. I know the birds dont like it as a rule. If you get em used to the clapping they will go with it and not the door opening. I think it was Dennis Hayes who told me that a long time ago. Best not to flag em out of the kitbox. It is their safe place.
yits/mho
v99
v99
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If they don`t kit,they don`t perform.
It`s a comp thing,understand?
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
671 posts
Jun 24, 2006
2:56 PM
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Hey Velo, its all in how you condition them. If you bop them on the head to get them out, its not a safe place. Look at that video, those are not birds that have been terrified by that flag. LOL
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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Velo99
512 posts
Jun 24, 2006
3:01 PM
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Hey Tony,
Different strokes bro.
yits
v99
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If they don`t kit,they don`t perform.
It`s a comp thing,understand?
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fhtfire
500 posts
Jun 24, 2006
5:09 PM
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I use a flag to get mine out of the kit box....the young birds know that when they see the flag it is time to fly. If I go out to the kits the just look at me..but if they see me pick up the flag they all perk up and stretch there wings and get the alert look...the know they are going to fly and they are ready. My birds relate the flag to flying...not from fear. I do not wave it around in the kit box of snap it..etc. just open the door and stick it in...if one lands on the roof of the kit box..i move it toward them....it is more or less the same as a whistle or feed can to food...Scott's birds know when he picks up the broom handle it is time to fly.
rock and Roll
Paul
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Santandercol
132 posts
Jun 24, 2006
10:23 PM
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O.k.,for sure there is a use for flags.I just think I went at it a little to rapidly with the young birds.I should have shown it to them at least when they were in their flypen or on the roof first.I used it today to keep my mature birds from landing to soon and it helped alot.they didn't get scared at all either.Them YBs are delicate eh!Even with all the pitfalls of learning to raise rollers and train 'em and all the darn preds around,I'm sure enjoying these little birds,let me tell ya!!!
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Kelly
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