rollerman132
28 posts
Nov 22, 2006
6:49 AM
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Is it ethical for someone to charge big bucks for their birds?
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belle
45 posts
Nov 22, 2006
7:13 AM
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Lots of people charge big bucks for their birds and some people pay big bucks for birds. If you have to ask if it is ethical than way ask?
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Santandercol
428 posts
Nov 22, 2006
7:26 AM
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My opinion is folks that sell birds are providing a service to others who would not otherwise be able to aquire them.Every Roller in my lofts were given to me GRATIS or raised here.If some one asks me for birds ,I'll do all I can to carry on the tradition of passing birds on at no charge,just to promote the hobby.
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Kelly
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nicksiders
857 posts
Nov 22, 2006
7:58 AM
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Whatever the market will bear. The question may be asked: Is it ethical to pay big money for rollers? What are you seeking? A short cut to success? Hoping to overcome your shortcomings as a good loft manager? What does motivates someone to pay outlandish money for rollers? Greed, maybe? I know what I charge when I have some I CAN'T keep. I know how much my limitation is when I have a brain-fart and think I need to buy some.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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J_Star
688 posts
Nov 22, 2006
8:08 AM
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Supply and demand sets the price. When you have a successful loft and everybody under the sun is seeking your birds, you cannot keep up with demand without establishing a roller factory. Therefore, your prices will go up to supply the onse who is willing to pay the price. On the other hand, you can get birds from other lofts with equaly quality birds just when you show great interest and great personality. You don't need a kit worth $2000 or more, all you need is couple pairs of good breeders and a determination for sucess....Jay
Last Edited by on Nov 22, 2006 8:48 AM
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fhtfire
656 posts
Nov 22, 2006
12:38 PM
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I don't think so....Racing fanciers have been doing it for years...although they do make big money on there competitions. I think that if someone has put there hard work into there birds...it is ok to charge. I have given away birds and I have sold birds....I have sold birds for cheap prices and good prices...based on what kind of mood I am in...LOL..or catching me at the right place and the right time. If you are in my Region...you will most likely get birds for free....if I have an extra round you will get a good price...if you have an overfly...I will give them to you...if my breeders have been pumping real hard and someone asks me to keep them together for one round...They will pay more...because I will use the money to buy some vitamins and water addatives to keep them healthy....again..it depends on the time and place...and if you have good birds. Nick brought up a good point...nobody is forcing you to buy birds....and you will give what ever price you feel is right or you can afford. I have even bought birds myself..to help out a club auction...or to get proven breeders to give me a leg up. Ethical...hell is it unethical to sell a race horse sperm for 10,000.00 ...nope...or a good cow or a parakeet...or how about a fish...just because they are rollers should have ne bearing on if it is ethical or not....it is supply and demand.
rock and ROLL
Paul
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knaylor
308 posts
Nov 22, 2006
1:22 PM
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I dont think it is. A person breeding them can sell them for what ever they want. If you dont want to buy them dont. The only thing thats not right in my opinion is when Guys are given birds and then turn around and sell them. This has happened alot and I think it is totally wrong!! I have seen when the guys even have the nerve to ask for more birds.
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RB&R
83 posts
Nov 22, 2006
2:05 PM
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I think when people want money for their birds because of thier time spend outside watching them. some people don't want to wast time for nothing...time is money, guys....if you really want good stock birds, all you really need is friendship. but remember that some friend ask for big buck, which he is not a real friend of you.
ANdrew
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C.J.
730 posts
Nov 22, 2006
2:32 PM
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I think a better question would be why do people think it isn't ethical. I personally don't sell my birds but I don't see a problem with guys who do. What ever the market will allow. The only problem is guys who either steal them or sell birds that were given to them. If you are paying big money for birds you had better see them in the air. I personally would not pay big money. My reasoning is they are great but there are bigger priorities in my life than throwing a small fortune away on birds that may die in transit or in quarantine or be hawk food. The only way I would spend big money is if they either laid golden eggs or crapped gold bracelets. lol
C.J.
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rollerman132
29 posts
Nov 22, 2006
2:53 PM
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I was just wondering if anyone thought it was wrong. There was this guy who stated on one of the older posts, that he had to buy his Jerry Higgins birds second hand (from a person who has his birds) because Jerry asked to much for his birds. Is it the name or the bird that makes us shell out the big bucks?
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JMHD
21 posts
Nov 22, 2006
3:53 PM
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I think in this case it's both i have been to Jerry's Loft plenty of times and the birds are great. Jerry gets alot of calls from all over the country fanciers wanting his birds and if he sells a few and he is always one of the top guys that is truely amazing. John M.
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Velo99
664 posts
Nov 22, 2006
5:03 PM
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I think Paul is the typical fancier as far as his standards for distribution of his birds. When I finally get my birds where I want them I will start charging. Until then I personally don`t feel they are worthy to sell for a profit. Not that they suck,just not what I would want to pay for if I were looking for birds. If I were to sell a kit I would have to charge a nominal fee to cover expenses.
jmho
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If they don`t kit,they don`t score.
Color don`t roll and peds don`t fly.
It`s a comp thing,understand?
V99
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katyroller
97 posts
Nov 22, 2006
7:57 PM
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Every breeder will have their own idea what their time, hard work and patience are worth. If the price seems to high to me, I pass but it doesn't make the price unethical. What would be unethical, is knowingly mislabeling proven crap as quality.
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George Ruiz
128 posts
Nov 22, 2006
9:18 PM
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Rollerman ethics have nothing to do with the price of a bird if the stock is what the seller says it is then there is no problem .
But when a guy LIES just to sell some birds that is UNETHICAL!!
Some people will lie through there teeth just to make a doller .
And as far as someone should give away birds theres two flip sides to that
1. sometimes the person recieving the birds thinks they aint worth a nickle becuase someone gave them to him .
2.if a person pays a good price he will probaly take care of his purchuse better than if it was free.
George
Last Edited by on Nov 22, 2006 9:19 PM
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John
26 posts
Nov 22, 2006
9:28 PM
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Guys,
Rollers are a hobby just like any other hobby. Would you take up golf and think someone should give you free clubs or shoes? No, you would buy the cheaper clubs or shoes until you got better at the game. No ones making any one buy the birds. Guys always want the best but they don't want to pay the price.Try to get the best for what you can spend.
John
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JMUrbon
59 posts
Nov 22, 2006
9:51 PM
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I feel that if somebody is selling birds than he is free to charge whatever he can get. They are only worth what somebody is willing to pay for them. The injustice is when you have guys that have been either breeding for very little time and basicly selling somebody elses name or even worse the guy who hasnt flown a bird in years but is selling birds based on their pedigree. My thought on those two is do your homework if you are looking to buy birds. Find out who are the main competitors and pursue them dont just pursue somebody because they said they have great rollers to sell. Make them prove it and put them in the air for you. Then you will truly know their value.
You also must know that in todays competitive roller world there arent many guys that will put their a team up and let you pick from them. Especially if they are trying to build a team. but as you watch their a teams and pick birds out see if you are able to get sibblings to the best and you will be better off than just purchasing a pedigree bred bird or a bird that somebody is claiming is a proven breeder. Guys ( They will all breed) most that are proven producers of quality are untouchable though so beware of that phrase. JMO Joe Urbon
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motherlodelofts
964 posts
Nov 22, 2006
9:54 PM
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They are worth whatever someone agrees to pay for them, I suggest that people do a "whole" lot more homework though before moving forward , if you just want to play pigeon don't worry about it though, just don't expect them to hang with the best and don't make excuses for them .
Scott
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JMUrbon
61 posts
Nov 22, 2006
9:56 PM
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Amen Scott
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motherlodelofts
965 posts
Nov 22, 2006
10:10 PM
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Joe good point on the "proven " producers , sure see a lot of guys claiming them for sale, funny I have to scratch hard for mine.
Most guys don't realize that there are such birds unidentified floating around undescovered in people lofts either though.
I have sent more than one kit of late hatches down the road and have a jewel of a producer pop up here and there for them.
My best producer right now came out of a kit that a guy had of this same family,there was a nice looking washed out rec. red that Kenny Billings bred.
I first used that bird as a foster but let it go one round but only got one youngster,that youngster was a "hammer", I now have childred and Grandchildren in stock off of that cock and much of my loft is starting to evolve around him.Tapp is getting a daughter off of him.
What I am getting at is it up to "you" to find such birds , it is doubtful that you will buy prooven stock birds.
Scott
Last Edited by on Nov 22, 2006 10:14 PM
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JMUrbon
63 posts
Nov 22, 2006
10:17 PM
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Very doubtful. I too have seen late hatches that I gave away turn into awsome birds for somebody else. Kinda makes you feel good though. A hell of alot better than if they were all culls. Joe
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RB&R
84 posts
Nov 23, 2006
7:33 PM
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it's just a hobby...it's not about money.
Last Edited by on Nov 23, 2006 8:16 PM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
844 posts
Nov 23, 2006
8:13 PM
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Hey Andrew, stop it. It is plain silly to assume that roller pigeons are to have price controls placed on them. If you cannot agree to a price, don't buy. It's really just that simple.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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Hector Coya
18 posts
Nov 24, 2006
6:37 AM
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Hey Rollermen
Im not ashemed to say i will sell a pigeon,
I came to realize that,
when a new person is starting out they value the bird at what they payed for it.
a while back i met a guy that was just starting out,verry exited about rollers,he gave me the imprecion that he wasnt
very well off,so I gave him 10 young and 2 stock pair for free.
About a month later i called him to ask how the birds where doing and he told me thanks for your help but i got rid of them,he said, i met this guy Jerry Higgins and i heard he's got the best so im going with his birds,
That's ok by me Jerry has some of the best,but if this guy would have payed money for mine he would have valued them more than to give them away.
He spent 2.000 at Jerrys,i could have used some of that money LOL.
Some people if you give them a bird for free they think,whats wrong with it,why dont you want it in your stock loft,
my opinion, Hector Coya
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rollerman132
30 posts
Nov 24, 2006
11:58 PM
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I have nothing against someone selling their birds, as long as the price tag fits the bird. If it’s true that we don’t sell our best birds, then why put a price tag on them to makes others believe they are? That in it self would make it unethical,a cull is a cull I dont care what blood line or name is behind it. If I’m going to pay five hundred bucks for a bird, that bird better breed top of the line rollers or talk for that kind of money.
Last Edited by on Nov 25, 2006 12:02 AM
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fhtfire
665 posts
Nov 25, 2006
8:41 AM
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How does putting a price tag on sound breeders and not the best breeders make a person think they are getting the best. Boy...I tell you what....You would know if you were getting my best pair...by the price tag....LOL!! To be honest there really is no price tag on your very best breeders.
rock and ROLL
Paul
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MILO
30 posts
Nov 25, 2006
9:51 AM
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What's with all the mystery here? I always thought that if someone wants good birds they are going to pay the asking price. If they don't like the price, they can move on. Big bucks for birds? It costs me 55 dollars to fill my gas tank every other day. Tomorrow, when I fill the tank I am going to tell the guy behind the glass that his gas is only worth 52 cents a gallon. Man, I never knew it was that simple. When the guy behind the glass tells me to go to hell, I'll tell him I'm a new driver, and shouldn't have to pay full price. LOL Guys, if they are decent birds then there should be no complaints. A guy that sells culls or mediocre birds claiming they are good breeders is a dirtbag.
c
Last Edited by on Nov 25, 2006 9:51 AM
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nicksiders
859 posts
Nov 25, 2006
3:29 PM
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I don't sell any of my birds. The best ones I keep; the others I don't keep, but I don't sell them and I don't give them away.
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Snicker Rollers
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viper
23 posts
Nov 26, 2006
6:45 AM
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If it don't hurt or make you think twice about the bird you are thinging of selling it belongs in the cat food dish.To many expect to win just because they have big name birds.If they don't win then the bashing starts.When its not the birds its the one taking care of them.You get what you pay for but I can't buy birds from say Scott or KGB or whoever and get the same results,it takes time.Blake
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