nicksiders
1568 posts
Apr 11, 2007
4:11 PM
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I was reviewing Monty Neibel's World Cup flying record from the beginning of the flys (1991) till his tragic death (2000). He left us without written explanations on how to do it. I think all champion roller guys/gals have an obligation to publish a "how to" writing. It is a shame that he did not do this for us. It is what HE did that made him a champion and not his birds. With the exception of John Weins (sp?) nobody is winning with his blood lines. I am not saying he didn't have good bloodlines; I am saying it was him that pushed them up and over the level of other good bloodlines. So, how did he do that? We have only a few tid-bits here and there; what people remember him saying; and very little else. He has let us down.
I am challanging all the Master Breeders; the WC Champions; the NBRC Champions to write us a manuscript on how you did it and do it now. You could be gone a car ride away and leave us nothing. To hear it from somebody else is just hear say and doesn't hold up in any court. You write it! Do it in first person, too.
Come on; get at it right now.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
Last Edited by on Apr 11, 2007 4:33 PM
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Flyin Hawaiian
125 posts
Apr 11, 2007
4:56 PM
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Hey Dork Nick, LOL
Ob viously you know nothing about Monty!! He alone shared with you and all who feed his yo yo system. Monty was the only one that I know of today that held no secrets. You must be hinding under a rock or your naive in thinking that he left nothing for us to hold on to. I flew with Monty since the early 70's and I can attest to you that he was a tremendous manager and trainer. One key thing about him he never compromised anything when it came to an out right cull no matter what bird in his stock loft bred it. The reason why so many that have had or have Monty's birds can't do much with them is they don't understand how to read pigeons like Monty did with his own. He kept them tight to the vest when it came to flying them on a regular daily basis. Monty professed to everyone when you fly your birds always have a plan don't just open up the door and let them out to exercise always have a game plan and set them up for the next fly. When it came to sharing knowledge about how to fly better rollers Monty was at the fore front same would apply for those that know him if you had garbage flying over your house he was in the forefront to let you know that too and he was always kind enough to offer you better birds with his generosity. He single handidly gave away more good pigeons than anyone I have ever been associated with. You need to do alot more research before coming out with a blind statement as to Monty took his knowledge to the grave leaving us with nothing!!
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nicksiders
1569 posts
Apr 11, 2007
5:12 PM
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Ivan,
I am a dork for sure. I may have not looked far enough for anything he published. He is the greatest flyer that I have ever had knowledge of, but I cannot find much on what he wrote; I can find a lot of what other people have said about his techniques and management skills. Just not a whole lot directly from him.
I wished I knew him personally as you did.
If you know of some publishing; point me in the right direction.
Nick The Dork
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Snicker Rollers
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birdman
324 posts
Apr 11, 2007
5:16 PM
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Nick, are you on heavy doses of medication?
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Flyin Hawaiian
126 posts
Apr 11, 2007
5:33 PM
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Hey Nick,
Do you have the NBRC 2000 Bulletin in memory of Monty and his accomplishments. Thier are articles in thier that he did write however the bulk of all of his articles can be found in numerous bulletins of the IRA (International Roller Association) during the mid 70's through the late eighties. If you can get your hands on some of those you will find alot of good information that he shared with us all. The 1974 APJ Roller special has an article by him that is titled "How I Do It" That would pretty much sum it up in a nutshell. Monty's foundation stock came from none other than Bruce Cooper of Kelso Washington and Monty always gave Bruce all the credit for his accomplishments.
Ivan
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Santandercol
974 posts
Apr 11, 2007
6:37 PM
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Nick,
It's OK to be a dork sometimes.Listen.I've got a bunch of Monty birds and lots of them are spinning like crazy.Just need to learn how to manage em right.Time spent is a big factor I beleive.Taking notes,adjusting feed amounts and just plain watching.
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Kelly
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nicksiders
1572 posts
Apr 11, 2007
8:22 PM
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Thanks Ivan.
Russ - It is early Al's hammer I am suffering from(LOL).
I want a book in front of me(LOL)
Bruce Cooper's name just keeps popping up doesn't it? I think I have the wrong birds(LOL)
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
Last Edited by on Apr 11, 2007 8:24 PM
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CSRA
143 posts
Apr 11, 2007
8:56 PM
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Nick keep your head up Ivan thanks for sharing that bit of knowledge with us
Last Edited by on Apr 11, 2007 8:56 PM
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birdman
326 posts
Apr 11, 2007
10:04 PM
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Nick, lay off the spiked coffee. LOL
Russ
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Bluesman
Pigeon Fancier
1127 posts
Apr 12, 2007
4:33 AM
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Ivan.I can fully understand where Nick is coming from.I too have heard about writings that Monty wrote and have all but begged to get my hands on some copies of them.
Personally I think you came down pretty hard on Nick.LOL.You say he should do some more research.Believe me I have spent hours trying to come up with Monty's writings.I only ever come up with one that someone shared with me.I think that is on the yo yo system of feeding.
You just don't get your hands on these old mags or bulletins from the later years.At least the ones I have heard about for sale went for more than I could afford.
The ones that do have his writings sure don't want to share them with anyone or it seems that way to me.
I do agree with you that Monty didn't let us down but I think that the ones that have his writings and don't share them is the ones that are letting us down.LOL. David
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Flyin Hawaiian
128 posts
Apr 12, 2007
5:37 AM
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Dave,
Brian Krogg in many of his writings has repeated over and over again like a parrott on Monty's writings and has submitted many of them to the NBRC mag. I think guys like myself and Dan Oullette and maybe a few others have brought to this form many articles of the past and I guess I'm assumming to much when I think guys that have birds go back further than you actually do LOL. I will dig up some more articles and send them in for your reading pleasure.
Ivan
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nicksiders
1573 posts
Apr 12, 2007
6:28 AM
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Well, David and I are in our 60's so we both go back a ways. Not always in the mainstream of competitive flyers, but we go back. We are now getting in the mainstream of competitive flying so we need to catch up and Monty is and was the KING. David and I along with the rest of the world can get our hands on Pensom's writing in one book; Graham Dexter's in one book; Tom Hatcher's in one book; Tony has published; and there are others. For some other crusial champion breeders we have to pick through several other releases and an article where and there and Monty is one of them. Its like hunting mushrooms or truffles.
Because I am not the sharpest marble in the bag (something I got from KGB) I need a book in my hand. Hell, Ivan you need to write one too......you owe us(LOL).
Thanks, David for having my back(LOL).
KGB you owe us one; Rick Mee you owes us one; Dave Moseley you owe us one; These are some of the guys who poke their heads in here now and then who have succeeded on an international level. And, there are some who need to start putting something together like Scott Campbell; Joe Urbon; Dave Henderson; Brian McCormick and some others. Doctor LD are you listening? How about you Russ; you have always got your head on straight? Yes Paul, even you(LOL). There ain't no fires at UC-Davis; do something with your time(LOL). Plant the seeds guys; you never know who may pick up the one book that strikes the match of interest in this hobby.
Don't let us down.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
1323 posts
Apr 12, 2007
11:51 AM
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Nick I sympathize with your desire and idea, but let me be the first to say that I am not obligized to do anything for this hobby, or for you or anyone else for that matter. When I chose to raise pigeons as a child, it didn't come with a contract specifying that at some point in my life I would be required to convey my personal experiences in order to fulfill some non-existent debt. This hobby owes me nothing and I owe it the same. This is MY hobby by choice, my feed bill, my time spent, my expenses, my enjoyments and even my saddness at times of losses. The only obligation I have is to my birds and my family.
I won't write a book nor will I share every one of my ideas. The rest can be found in the pages of the web site should someone care to dig around.
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W@yne
361 posts
Apr 12, 2007
1:49 PM
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Brian
You got up on the wrong side of the bed. Nicksiders asked you a question not to be answered abruptly and in my opinion rude. You should be honoured for a guy to ask you to write a book and share your knowledge amongst other flyers and roller enthusiasts. Come on Brian if you dont want to write a book just say so but in a nice way. I think Brian you need a reality check and come back down to earth.
Just my opinion
W@yne uk
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Patience Perseverance Perfection
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spinner jim
78 posts
Apr 12, 2007
1:55 PM
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Nick,i have in my possession the 1876 book by Robert Fulton and if any of you guys would like me to search through it for references of any kind i am willing,it has references to health and remedies,loft management all sorts its been sitting here twenty years lol its about time someone got use out of it,jim uk.
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birdman
327 posts
Apr 12, 2007
2:51 PM
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Wayne, with all due respect I fully agree with Brian. Nobody owes anyone in this hobby anything, period.
Knowledge that is freely shared is one thing but to make the statement that "all champions roller guys/gals have an obligation to publish a how-to" is a bit much. What makes them obligated to anyone for anything?
What next? Are all the top flyers obligated to let everybody use their stockbirds?
My .02
Russ
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spinner jim
80 posts
Apr 12, 2007
3:15 PM
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You guys make me laugh,brian wants to give nothing back to the hobby he loves but where would he be without the information gained on this site, also knowledge passed on over the years from friends and fellow enthusiasts from the hobby, put something back brian ,you cant keep it all in the bank, the people who have helped me over the years i am very greatful to and try my best to put plenty back in when time permits,our love of the fly has to be promoted and pushed for the new fanciers to come in and keep it going, i feel better now i have had my moan lol, jim uk.
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
1325 posts
Apr 12, 2007
3:21 PM
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Wayne, there is nothing rude about saying exactly why I don't agree with the insinuation that we have an "obligation". Don't take things so personal. If I just said No, then I would be asked to explain why. There I just did in the previous post, killed two birds with one stone..lol
Jim, this site is great for information and I enjoy posting my opinions or experiences in concert with others on topics. But this is different from implying that a person MUST, as a right of passage in this hobby, commit to publishing a book revealing the full spectrum of management and ideas. I'm not against anyone doing so and for those that do, great. But however the mere idea that someone is Obligated is wrong. That isn't to hang Nick for saying so as I know what he really meant by his initial post.
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nicksiders
1578 posts
Apr 12, 2007
7:24 PM
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Maybe I should have said "pretty please with sugar on it". It did read like I was demanding that these guys actually do something for the rest of us poor slobs. Oh, well like a good dog I will be thrilled with the crumbs and scraps from thier table.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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George Ruiz
230 posts
Apr 12, 2007
7:40 PM
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Nick
Dont hang around my table because I dont drop many scraps
LOL
George
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trevsta65
102 posts
Apr 12, 2007
8:02 PM
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theres nothing wrong with asking nick i think it would be an honour to be ask to put something down on paper if you have a wealthy knowledge of these fine birds its not like we all no everything .i to like to read rather than just be told something sinks in a bit better (lol)so guys dont take all your knowledge to the grave with you give us lesser kind a leg up . cheers trev
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nicksiders
1580 posts
Apr 12, 2007
8:25 PM
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George,
You can write one, too(LOL)
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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George Ruiz
231 posts
Apr 12, 2007
8:27 PM
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You dont want everyone leaving the hobby like Milo do you Nick?
george
Last Edited by on Apr 12, 2007 8:28 PM
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gotspin7
84 posts
Apr 13, 2007
5:13 AM
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George, too funny! share some of that knowledge, well if you want....lol
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Santandercol
981 posts
Apr 13, 2007
6:29 AM
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Nick,
I was talking last night to Al Hunt in Lumby,B.C and Aaron Johnson up in Kamloops.They were good freinds with Monty,and both of them have in their possession extensive writings by the old Champ.As soon as they send me some of these,I'll post whatever there is on here to share with you guys.
YITS,
Kel.
"They gotta stick together like sardines in a can and roll right down the judges throat" I know he said that!!
Last Edited by on Apr 15, 2007 6:34 AM
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nicksiders
1581 posts
Apr 13, 2007
11:02 AM
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Hey, thanks Kelly
I'll print them and publish my own Monty book(LOL). I could embellish a little bit and put my name on it....what ya think?
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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