Deadendkid
39 posts
Nov 15, 2007
1:20 PM
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do you guys think todays birds are better then birds that flew 30 years ago ? please explain why.
i think birds were better back in the days when more people flew their birds all year around and didnt the problems everyone has today.
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RUDY..ZUPPPPP
470 posts
Nov 15, 2007
2:54 PM
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Old School Birds...lol
I think thy were better...just my thinking
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Skylineloft
359 posts
Nov 15, 2007
3:19 PM
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Ask one of the old guys, they lived it....lol
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Ray
Breeding Quality Spinners,
"One Roller At A Time".
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1868 posts
Nov 15, 2007
7:32 PM
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Hey Dago, provided nothing else has been added to these old family lines, the birds are genetically the same. So the guys who work with this old stock have no reason, besides their own in-ability, to have anything less than what these old-timers did.
One difference that might be important is that the "learning curve" is not as steep now as it was then due to speeded up communications that we have today (can you say Internet?).
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Support This Site With Your Pigeon Product Purchase-Over 100 Pigeon Products!
Last Edited by on Nov 15, 2007 7:32 PM
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Santandercol
1633 posts
Nov 15, 2007
7:53 PM
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True,Tony,but it is harder to train a kit of birds if they are born too close a time to lockdown.In the times during the 1950s till probably late 80's early '90s when many species of birds of prey were threatened with extinction largely due to insecticide use,Roller fanciers experienced few if any attacks on their birds while flying.So in those days it maybe was easier to train a good kit of Rollers,but I do beleive we can still keep breeding and flying good ones,just need to work within the timeframe we have to breed and fly sensibly,and live with that.
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Kelly
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Richard
86 posts
Nov 15, 2007
8:05 PM
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I think the birds are better than years ago. there certainly is a lot more better ones. For every good one 25 years ago there are a hundred today.
RJM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1869 posts
Nov 15, 2007
8:25 PM
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Hey Richard, why do you think they are better today? Did they not have the same traits in their birds then that we prize today?
* Type
* Expression
* Character
* Frequency
* Velocity
* Depth
* Feather
* etc??
While I agree with you in that I think there is a higher "quantity" of good rollers today due to improvements in speed of communications, but I am still inclined to say the quality in the traits today are the same as they were then.
I am willing to be shown how I may be wrong about this.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Support This Site With Your Pigeon Product Purchase-Over 100 Pigeon Products!
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Donny James
108 posts
Nov 15, 2007
8:38 PM
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i think birds are better today because i think the guys are smarter and know how to handle there birds...........donny james
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1870 posts
Nov 15, 2007
9:14 PM
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Hey Donny, okay, just what is it in your view, that we are doing today that is smarter than what the old-timers did? ;-)
PS. Did you get that check?
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Support This Site With Your Pigeon Product Purchase-Over 100 Pigeon Products!
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Richard
87 posts
Nov 16, 2007
7:52 AM
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Tony
YOu telling me the flyers today are setting on their back side and not improving the BR. If so I think you are wrong. Look at most things today compaired to 25 years ago Better or worse?
Richard M
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W@yne
759 posts
Nov 16, 2007
8:29 AM
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I would say over here in the UK theres more in numbers of good kits flying,
I am not saying that the roll has got any better in the roller what i will say is that there are more in numbers of great spinning rollers.
You can see a champion bird in most established kits that fly competition level here in the UK.
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Regards
W@yne UK
Patience Perseverance Perfection
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1872 posts
Nov 16, 2007
1:10 PM
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Hey Richard, okay, let's say you are correct, the BR today is better today than it was 30 or 40 years ago, my question is what specifically what was done to make the Birmingham Roller better?
I need specifics, please.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Support This Site With Your Pigeon Product Purchase-Over 100 Pigeon Products!
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nicksiders
2488 posts
Nov 16, 2007
1:18 PM
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The Birmingham Roller has not gotten better. We just have more good ones than there used to be. Todays breeders are more skilled the the breeders of yesteryear. The average breeder of today would have been a legend back then.
ah.........in my opinion
Nick
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BigRiverRollerLofts
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hectorvicki2003@yaho
48 posts
Nov 16, 2007
4:46 PM
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I think the birds are the same.
How mush faster do you think we can get this breed to roll.I cant imagine a bird rolling any faster,so whats to improve?
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Hector Coya
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ezeedad
35 posts
Nov 16, 2007
7:03 PM
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I guess I'm different...again... but it seems to be harder to find a real champion spinner
I think it is harder to find rollers that show the hole now.
Maybe it's because people can get around so much these days as compared to say... 100 years ago. Back in those days I think there was less temptation to breed to outside birds. Nowadays the breed has been firmly established for so long that todays breeders in general don't appreciate the importance of inbreeding and not crossing out of ones' own strain.
Gomez
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big al
248 posts
Nov 17, 2007
9:45 AM
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Hi guys,
Many of you have made very valid points which in essence answers the initial question accurately. There are a few things to consider.
The World Cup and Fall Fly for the most part are relatively new additions to the hobby that require fliers in more cases than not to rise to another level in their training and breeding practices. This does not neccesarily mean there are better birds now but more of them. Due to the internet and cell phones, accesibility to breeders and fliers has become much easier, which in turn provides endless accesibility to their birds! Lawn shows and clubs here in California alone are greater in number than they were in the eighties when I flew before, again providing more opportunity to get great birds. The NBRC has grown. Any of the top fliers can be contacted and birds purchased.
So the great birds were always here but not many of us had them!
Back in the eighties when I used to hang out and get all my birds from the late Bob Scott, he had birds every bit as good as some of the ones I see today.
Our knowledge of genetics has improved dramatically, so has the knowledge for color breeding. We are more knowledgable about training comp kits, housing and many other aspects of the hobby. There were a handful of guys who had all this knowledge in the early days but not as many as we may think.
Today there are more of us with knowledge on creating and maintaining strong, productive, families for competition and performance.
So in my opinion the the genetic traits, ability and body types were always here,there are just more of us who know what to do.
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See you in the roll!
Allen Strother (Big Al)
"High Plains Spinner Loft"
Last Edited by on Nov 17, 2007 10:45 AM
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crystalpalace
182 posts
Nov 17, 2007
12:38 PM
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The Master Breeders of yesterday bred Competition Birmingham Rollers as good as they are today. Fifty years ago the popularity of breeding and flying became more intence. Bill Pensom moved to California and joined the Los Angeles Pigeon Club. Then many other all-breed clubs were located in California. Bill also traveled to other states in the West coast and showed his birds at the National Pigeon Association Annual Shows. This gave him the opportuity to promote the breed in the United States and England. Then some fanciers that purchased his birds became promoters of the breed too. The popularity of the breed has become so intence througout the world that more quality stock has been bred and flown. I have bred and flown the breed for more than sixty years and have seen a few champion Rollers. The breeder with champion stock has a better chance to breed a champion. This Roller site that Tony has organized has heped many new fanciers because breeders with a lot of experiance have posted. The integrety of better judgeing and rules along with sportsmanship is something everyone of us should take into consideration seriously. Sonny Ray
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birdman
437 posts
Nov 17, 2007
1:01 PM
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Ray, Are your birds different in size and type than they were 60 years ago?
Thanks.
Russ
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