GREED FOR SPEED LOFT
312 posts
Dec 05, 2007
10:22 PM
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Deadendkid, you are right I did forget about Frank Lathrop(so sorry Frank),another good flyer and person. Frank did fly good birds and knew what to look for.Deadend how did it come to be that you know Frank?
R-LUNA
Last Edited by on Dec 06, 2007 6:14 AM
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Bluesman
Pigeon Fancier
1182 posts
Dec 06, 2007
6:38 AM
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Richard. Good question.Only a few will know who the Deadendkid really is.LOL. david
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gotspin7
751 posts
Dec 06, 2007
6:06 PM
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Don't matter any more! (deadendkid)
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Sal Ortiz
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Deadendkid
156 posts
Dec 06, 2007
7:23 PM
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greed i know frank becuase i went with my uncle to pick up birds from him in 1999 the birds were don oullette bloodlines
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gotspin7
769 posts
Dec 06, 2007
7:24 PM
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So youre back, Cool!
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Sal Ortiz
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JMUrbon
299 posts
Dec 06, 2007
7:53 PM
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I am going to chime in here and add my two cents if you guys don't mind. First off I have to agree 100% with Kenny's post. I will say that with the quality of stock available today that you can go just about anywhere and see a good bird. You can't go anywhere and see a kit of good birds. The competitions have made us who do compete work very hard at breeding more quality birds. I am not going to say that the breeder that flies for enjoyment isn't trying to improve his birds but rather that it is much easier to see what you are trying to do if you pick, select and choose against the best. By allowing your birds to be judged by somebody that is an experienced judge is only going to improve your knowledge of what you should be looking for so long as you are able to take the criticism. I think that that is where Kenny is getting the scared part from. I feel your birds are your's to do with what you please but I also feel that you will only get out of them what you put into them. Just having good birds isn't enough. That's only half the battle. Knowing how to work a team and knowing how to identify their traits ( good and bad) and being able to adjust accordingly is where the real work begins. JMUrbon
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J.M.Urbon Lofts
A Proven Family of Spinners
http://www.freewebs.com/jmurbonlofts/
Last Edited by on Dec 06, 2007 7:55 PM
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smk
60 posts
Dec 06, 2007
8:29 PM
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maybe i shouldn't chime in on this one having not competed yet, but we should all know that competiton is the mechanism through which we find a better product its what drives every industry out there. with only 1.5 breedings seasons under my belt i know i don't have the goods to compete yet but will still put a kit up this spring mainly to support the fly's what have i got to lose. like i've heard it said many times what the hell there's always next year....lol...
your in the sport
rock-n-roller loft
scott
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Alohazona
357 posts
Dec 06, 2007
9:36 PM
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Joe,
Thanks for translating Kenny's post,LOL.Your a nice guy and it's great to see you posting again.
Flying in competitions is the ultimate, there is nothing out there that evaluates rollers better.than putting up your birds for an experienced judge.Judging in my opinion is very subjective though,from one judge to another,from club flys to regional finals, to W/C to FF finals,panel judging you name it.One thing is constant an experienced fancier has to put in his two cents based on what he sees ,and his interpretation of the competition rules.Judges experience can go from a couple of years, to 10 and 20 years plus.The judges with vast experience doesn't necessarily mean they are better, but in general they are.So a judge with 3 to 5 years can be pretty right on,with their judging skills.
I have alot to learn about competing with rollers.Kenny has his own style about getting his point across,and I always look forward to a solid post from Kenny.It always puts a few more hairs on my chest,I just wish it wasn't those gray buggahs,LOL.....Aloha,Todd
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richard.r
87 posts
Dec 07, 2007
6:27 AM
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Deadendkid! Is your uncle George Ruiz Right!
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smoke747
97 posts
Dec 07, 2007
8:44 AM
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I FLY ROLLERS BCAUSE I LIKE TO SEE THEM ROLL. IFLY IN COMPETITIONS BECAUSE FOR ONE, I AM COMPETITIVE,2ND IT KEEPS ME ON TOES TRYING TO IMPROVE MY BIRDS IN EVERY POSSIBLE WAY. I LIKE TO GO SEE OTHERS BIRDS AND WHEN I SEE A REAL GOOD KIT WITH REAL GOOD BIRDS IN IT I GET PUMPED AND WANT GET HOME TO MY LAB(LOFT) AND GET BUSY.
RAY F.,STEVE S., STEVE R., ALL DID THAT FOR ME THIS YEAR.
IT KEEPS ME FOCUSED!!!!
SMOKE747
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maxspin
133 posts
Dec 07, 2007
9:57 AM
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smk,
I don't believe that there is any such thing as "don’t have the goods to compete yet".
Here is what you are getting for your entry fee.
1. Your local Regional Director (Usually an experienced roller man)
2. The judge. (An experienced roller man)
3. many experienced roller men along from the region.
It is a small price to get that many experts in you back yard.
Tell them how you prepped the birds for the fly and ask for advice.
Have them handle your breeders, and tell you what they like and don't like about your birds.
If you continue to support "them" in the big competitions you are showing them that you are serious. When/if you go to them to try to improve your stock they are much more likely to help someone with that special bird or two that will help you get to the next level. They will believe that you are serious only if you show them that you are serious.
Keith Maxwell
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smk
62 posts
Dec 07, 2007
4:15 PM
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Hi Keith, I don't know if I insinuated that my birds are not good enough I have a few very good families I was refering to my skills as a feeder\handler at this point in time but I do appreciate the information on what I will get for my entry fee I'm not being sarcastic I mean it
thanks
scott
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Skylineloft
520 posts
Dec 08, 2007
7:13 PM
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I agree with Smoke....
Nothing like competition to get you motivated.
Thanks for the complement Keith.
I look foreword to seeing your birds this year.
I have herd nothing but good things about you and your birds.
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Ray
Breeding Quality Spinners,
"One Roller At A Time".
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Windjammer Loft
98 posts
Dec 09, 2007
11:17 AM
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I deffinately have to take the side of PR_roller.It sounds like most of the COMP guys are in their own little world. Get a life. And if your not IN it, your not With it. I, for one could CARE less about the competitive aspect. Mainly because of the attitude of those that are.. I've been around too many clubs, all the comp people are in the same mind set but thats not for ME. I don't personnely care for that attitude. All I know is that I have my birds for MY pleasure and enjoyment and couldn't CARE less about what others think about them. How DARE ANY of yous to make accusations of any nature about ME. You guys DON'T even know ME. Plus I have a LIFE....I enjoy doing alot of other things that take time from my life.
Birds are not my only interest.The more I hear these kinds of comments like SCARED or LAZY or what ever name calling you want to put with this, are reasons I don't fly com.And the LESS and LESS I want to associate with forums like this. Which, looks like this might just be the reason I to STOP. I will look at this site in the future for reasons of purchases only.Good bye
Fly High and Roll On
Paul
Last Edited by on Dec 09, 2007 11:31 AM
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Electric-man
937 posts
Dec 09, 2007
12:11 PM
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Wished that you would reconsider Paul! Their are plenty of people on your side of the fence! I knew when I read the first post, answering the question, that the line was gonna be drawn once again between the do's and the dont's! Shame we always have to be didvided! These kind of arrogant answers, need to be thought out a little bit more before throwing them out there with little regard to whom we offend! Are we really helping the hobby or are we just being destructive when we make such acuzations! I'm only directing this opinion to the ones that the shoes fit of course!
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Val
"Site Moderator"
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RUDY..ZUPPPPP
669 posts
Dec 09, 2007
1:36 PM
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Zuppppppp Val.............
Well Paul has a point when they say Lazy or Scared..Cmon..
Let me use myself as example just because i dont compete
that doesnt make me lazy or scared,bull S@#$.....
I wanna compete dont get me wrong but no flyers close enough....Peace
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RUDY PAYEN
PANCHO VILLA LOFT
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Electric-man
938 posts
Dec 09, 2007
2:28 PM
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Zup Rudy, you do relize that I'm agreeing with Paul and speaking against the first response to the question! I'm not saying that I agree or disagree with the contents of the first response, just the way it is thrown out there! There are some that have the gift of knowledge when it comes to rollers but have the attitude that, if you don't like what I have to say, $%*^ off! How does that improve the hobby?
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Val
"Site Moderator"
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J T
68 posts
Dec 09, 2007
3:00 PM
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Compete if you got them.
If you don’t, try to enhance your gene pool with
better birds and work the snot out of them.
Don’t become discouraged when someone on the list
won’t return your e-mails. They will talk bad about YOUR birds but will not help you out.
If you are not a part of their group or in the Click
you are probably out of luck.
Keep looking,, you may find a friend
with something BETTER!!
That will help you out, for FREE or a small fee, just to help members out.
Some are FEATHER Merchants some will become True Friends.
JT
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Skylineloft
527 posts
Dec 09, 2007
4:47 PM
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Paul,
I understand your frustration by other peoples opinions on weather you you should compete and weather that makes you a better roller-man then the next guy if you do or do not. Norm Reed does not compete anymore , at least he has not in quite some time and I consider him to be one of the best roller-men of our time. He can still put up one hell of a kit. I try not to judge people by weather they fly comp or not, its just good to see so many people enjoying this hobby together and there birds. That being said Paul please do not take comments personal just because you do not compete. I know that I would love to come see your birds one day and from what I have read about you its great to know that your flying rollers just to enjoy rollers....
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Ray
Breeding Quality Spinners,
"One Roller At A Time".
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JMUrbon
302 posts
Dec 09, 2007
4:56 PM
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Thanks Todd, Paul I hope you reconsider. AS far as the competition frame of mine I really get disappointed when we that do compete are thrown into the same attitude mixing pot as a few that seem to have the fly or shut up attitude. I for one could really care less what anybody else does with their birds. I dont compete because I have to or because any one elso wants me to. I do it because I like to see if I have improved my kits from year to year in somebody other than in my eyes. I have judged kits for many years so it would be easy for me to say yes they have improved but I still like to get anothers objective opinion.
I will add that I do believe some of the best fliers out there are not flying competition for the same reasons as you state Paul but that doesnt mean that myself or 99% of the fliers out there that do had anything to do with running them off. I have always tried to treat another flier with respect and although I may ask some harsh questions they are not disrespectful and if they have been then that was not my intention and I do apalogize to anybody that feels I have disrespected them.
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J.M.Urbon Lofts
A Proven Family of Spinners
http://www.freewebs.com/jmurbonlofts/
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gotspin7
778 posts
Dec 09, 2007
5:11 PM
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Paul, do not take it so personal! Your good by me! I fly comps just started back this year and I have had the pleasure to meet some great roller flyers!
Joe, good post!
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Sal Ortiz
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1993 posts
Dec 09, 2007
5:20 PM
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Hey Joe, your class is showing...
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Support This Site With Your Pigeon Product Purchase-Over 100 Pigeon Products!
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JMUrbon
303 posts
Dec 09, 2007
5:45 PM
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Thanks Sal ,and Tony.
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J.M.Urbon Lofts
A Proven Family of Spinners
http://www.freewebs.com/jmurbonlofts/
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Ballrollers
990 posts
Dec 09, 2007
5:49 PM
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Paul,
I believe you missed the mark considerably. You're generalizations about the men who compete apply to only a very few, but vocal, among us. Most guys that I have met through competitions are salt-of-the-earth kinds of guys....probably just like you....
Cliff
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Electric-man
941 posts
Dec 09, 2007
7:08 PM
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I stay around because of people like the ones that have made the last few post! Talk about "salt of the earth people"! A lot of good people here Paul,I've always, and many others here I'm sure, consider you one too!Hang around Bro!
Good to hear from you Joe U.!
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Val
"Site Moderator"
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Mongrel Lofts
474 posts
Dec 09, 2007
7:38 PM
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Hi Paul,
I see my opinion bothers you like it does so many others on Tony's. Truly sorry to see that you take my experience personally. I have tried to share what I truly beleive about breeding and flying this breed Birmingham roller.. Please stick around. This is my last post to this site. I will stick to reading your guys post and opinions and keep mine to myself. Stick around Paul, You won't hear no more from me and there is a lot to learn here.. KGB
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Skylineloft
532 posts
Dec 09, 2007
7:52 PM
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Come on ken,
Yes there are many different opinions here posted from many different types of roller breeders, but to stop posting all together, Your opinions and expertise is needed here.
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Ray
Breeding Quality Spinners,
"One Roller At A Time".
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J_Star
1448 posts
Dec 09, 2007
7:59 PM
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We can't please everyone. I wonder sometimes why in the world do we take things too personaly!!! They are just frigging pigeons.
Jay
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tapp
486 posts
Dec 09, 2007
10:04 PM
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I agree with Ray KGB, Stick around OK! Kim Tappenden
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Tapp
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smoke747
110 posts
Dec 09, 2007
10:08 PM
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HEY PAUL,
NO NEED TO QUIT YOUR LIST.STICK IN THERE, THE HOBBY WILL ALWAYS BE FILLED WITH CONTROVERSY. I FOR ONE DON'T FEEL LIKE EVERY HAS TO FLY IN COMP. MOST OF US STARTED RAISING PIGEONS FOR THE LOVE OF PIGEONS AND DIDN'T EVEN HAVE ROLLERS, LET ALONE COMPETE WITH EM. I GOT MORE COMPETITIVE WITH AGE. BASKETBAL SKILLS WENT DOWN, I GOT MORE COMPETITVE WITH THE BIRDS. NO MORE DUNKIN BASKETBALLS, STARTED FLYIN PIGEONS THAT ROLL LIKE BALLS LOL.
JUST HANG IN THERE.
PEACE TO YOU MY ROLLER BROTHER
K.LONDON SMOKE747
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PR_rollers
208 posts
Dec 09, 2007
10:39 PM
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Paul,don't let anyone make you post your last post..I understand where you coming from,my wife tells me sometime why do i go here from reading some of these post i can see this its not the place for you..but i always say there are a lot of good people here ,,this is my family when it comes to birds,this is why i stand up for not just me but others because we are family here... Joe Urban you are a good man i know you from Dave Henderson, i agree with you too what Ken said about competition ,,is the way he says thing that hurt people and i know he is a good man too.. he just need to change his ways of talking sometime ,instead of that Popeye saying ,I am what I am thats what I am.that use to be me too,,but my new saying is ,,your life is calling you I want to be able to look back on my life and say well live from the heart;;;;; as you can see I'm still posting ..your input is important to us too..
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Ralph....
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COYOTE33
24 posts
Dec 10, 2007
6:44 AM
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Actually, paul and KGB as i stated in my first response,
i do appreciate those expressing themselves. i think this suject might unite us if you really think about it,because now we understand the difference of the individuals in this hobby. now we might be a little more cauious when we do express ourselves, but there is no reason to quit, you have actually helped and i say thany you.
coyote
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Ballrollers
992 posts
Dec 10, 2007
7:16 AM
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Keep in mind fellas.....there are 1500-1600 members in the NBRC. Only 2-300 compete. The vast majority of the hobby is made up of back yard flyers. And most of us who compete, kept thes birds for many years in our backyards before we ever decided to compete.....
Cliff
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Windjammer Loft
116 posts
Jan 06, 2008
8:43 AM
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KGB... Its not your opinion that is in question. Their are some things that you state your opinion on that I do take seriously. Its your BLANKET statement:
Backyard flyers either can't handle the heat of competition or in 99% of the cases lack the quality of bird or the work ethic to fly good competition kits. LAZY or SCARED, or poor quality rollers!
I think its unfair to make a blanket statement like that. By far,I am not LAZY nor SCARED and thier are many fanciers out thier that fit into this castorgy. At this time in my life I just don't have the TIME it takes to prepare a kit for any type of competion,except my own expectation. I have too many other things that take priorty. And right now my birds are for pure entertainment. Plus,Iam in the LEARNING stage, which takes time
I think COMPETITION is GOOD, but at the RIGHT time.
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Fly High and Roll On
Paul
Last Edited by on Jan 06, 2008 8:47 AM
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mr.b.j
172 posts
Mar 08, 2009
12:06 AM
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As 4 me ... yes i do fly comp ... The reason y i do is - cuz i like other folks 2 see my birds do what they do ... I love it.
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MR.BJ USRC
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Scott
1804 posts
Mar 08, 2009
8:35 AM
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Funny how one of the most respected flyers in the country (KGB) posts his opinion from his experiance and guys get all bent out of shape LOL
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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Alohazona
587 posts
Mar 08, 2009
11:58 AM
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Scott,
I think you'll find a majority of the responses agreed with Ken.It was his raspy delivery which earned him the negative feedback.
I think the list showed alot of respect for ken by overlooking his 3 year personal struggle and absence from competing.Anyone else would have easily been raked over the coals.
I have alot respect for ken as a person and a flyer.I also hope things are going smoother for him, so he can continue to enjoy his birds as he see's fit...Aloha,Todd
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PR_rollers
GOLD MEMBER
2653 posts
Mar 08, 2009
12:15 PM
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Hey Todd I never got to say good post to you well now that it is back good post >"we all have to remember is we are competing with ourselves,not others,and the birds are an extension of that.A balance is the best one could hope for,sometimes it works out and sometimes we fall short.When negative labels are put to otherwise well intended fanciers,what has been gained?Controversy?Controversy has been the biggest bummer about the roller sport/hobby.The problem is experienced fanciers who should know better keep bringing it up,it's just so ingrained.This thread is a set-up for more of the same.
Deadendkid,this is a sport and a hobby.Some lean to the competitiveness with others,some go it alone,it's as simple as that.There are competitors that will treat roller flying as a hobby.It's all in ones perception,there is no wrong or right....Aloha,Todd
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Ralph.
miss opportunity are the curse of potential well if opportunity is not knocking you build the door...
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Scott
1807 posts
Mar 08, 2009
1:00 PM
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Todd , it is silly to think their is a single poster on this forum could rake Kenny over the coals where this breed and flying and competing is concerned , he is unmatched here on this forum on his ability ,that is a fact.
As for his three years, bullshit, he never quit flying or competing,in fact he won the kiddie fly in that time frame, never have I see anyone move and field a team as quickly as he can.
As for his opinion, he was spot on where backyard flyers are concerned, and that is the whole crux, there are those that talk,and then there are those that fly,the flyers let the birds do the talking for them.
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Just my Opinion
Scott
Last Edited by on Mar 08, 2009 1:06 PM
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Alohazona
588 posts
Mar 08, 2009
2:04 PM
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Scott,
Unless there is someone else posting here as Mongrel lofts,then it was ken himself that indicated his time for a break.Re-read the first two sentences of his post.
This thread is not about ken or his ability to fly BR's.
Yes,there are WORLD CLASS posters here,so ken is in good company.
As a judge and a businessman,you should know that the nbrc would not be relavant based on the people who ONLY choose to compete and regularly enter nbrc sanctioned events.
Fellowship would be the one word I could use for the remainder of the members.Being a part of the BR fellowship.
Scott,you are in a very small but extremely popular minority,regarding being a competition flyer or being a backyard enthusiest.
Like you said before "TALK IS CHEAP" and I see you guys doing an equal amount of talking on your side of the fence and that scott, is a Fact.
Deep breaths,Scott...Deep,breaths.....Aloha...Todd
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Scott
1813 posts
Mar 08, 2009
3:16 PM
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Todd, never have you seen me talking up my birds ,never ! but I will and do put them up and pit them against others at every opportunity, and there is is the difference between flyers and non flyers.
(Like you said before "TALK IS CHEAP" and I see you guys doing an equal amount of talking on your side of the fence and that scott, is a Fact.)
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Just my Opinion
Scott
Last Edited by on Mar 08, 2009 3:22 PM
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Alohazona
589 posts
Mar 08, 2009
7:43 PM
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The talk is cheap thing was not directed at how you speak of your birds,scott.It is the generalizations ken ,yourself,and others perpetuate[lazy,poor work ethic,scared,poor quality stock].You guys try to pass this off as constructive critizing.
The debates that go on these forums,not just this one,would never make it to print in the nbrc bulletin.Why!because you can.
Every paid up member of the nbrc recieves a bulletin.
Nothing denoting that a backyard flyer is a substandard fancier would ever see print.It would be a detriment to the hobby...Aloha,Todd
PS.lets get back to talking about the birds.I fly the WC next weekend,how about you?
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nicksiders
GOLD MEMBER
3300 posts
Mar 09, 2009
7:02 AM
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Competition prevents loft blindness
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Just My Take On Things
Nick Siders
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harrison
367 posts
Mar 09, 2009
11:15 AM
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PR Rollers.
I have had chats with you and I respeckt you .
Come across as a nice guy.
As for saying backyard flyers carnt handle the heat or they dont have the qualitey (BULL SHIT)
Were I live SADLEY there his no longer a roller club.
If they was I would be first in line to join.
I am not been clever o trying to be someone I am not but I no what my birds can do and please believe me I would match most of you no problem.
And with my birds at there BEST of BEST proberly beat most of you.
Backyard flyers carnt handle the heat or havent got the goods.
Your better than that mate.
yours in roll harrison uk hull.
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Square
648 posts
Mar 09, 2009
2:18 PM
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WOW, not gonna really let emountion get involved in this one but its a great topic. Espically for me, There is alot of reasons one wouldent fly comp, maby they live to far outta the way or other things Kinda like J T mentioned.I Also rember seeing somthing about backyard Guys being scared...LOL that's a good one but there is the flip side to that coin also, because comp guys can be scared of the backyard/new guys. The more folks get off what they truly enjoy then it allows egos, clicks and just all around scandolus behavior to take over. Its not that easy to compete with your rollers, I thought all I had to do was build a family I was proud of then compare them to the greats in comp,,,NOPE Not that easy. What has been easy for me personally is going back to the basics and for me that is just enjoying my birds point blank. The comp thing can be a bad deal, But if you allow all the BS to take over then you lost without even flying your birds. So to awnser the question I will try to fly comp to prove my rollers, However I relize that that is just a small part of why I love and enjoy my rollers. It's way eiser for me to deal with my pigeons than people..LOL I will always deal with my rollers, but not nessarly some people. Best of luck if you fly comp of not...Truly 1
Square.
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"Home of the Ghost Town Roller"
K.C.R.C
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