elopez
110 posts
Dec 02, 2007
11:02 PM
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Hello List,
I have a Red self cock around 9 months old. He doesn't even turn over once. Good kit bird but not one flip. What I find strange is that he is off of one of my best pairs. The father wasn't flown but siblings were 30-40' spinners and the mother is an excellent producer that has produced some of Keith London's breeders. Even more odd is that his younger 3 siblings were some of the best birds I've seen fly. Super fast and frequent with great style 15-25'. I've lost all 3 to the hawks. I am putting this pair down again next season but just can't figure out why this red self isn't performing like his younger siblings.
The father is a black self, the mother is a black bronze badge. The siblings have been 2 black selfs and 1 dark checker. Do you think that the color has something to do with it? Please let me know your thoughts...
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Efren Lopez
SGVS
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ezeedad
123 posts
Dec 02, 2007
11:59 PM
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I don't think there's anything wrong with the bird. I've had many birds that took over a year to come in, and when they did they were some of my best.
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Missouri-Flyer
1039 posts
Dec 03, 2007
1:24 AM
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Not all birds turn out like we want..Maybe a cull? We all breed them.
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Jerry
Home of "Whispering Wings Loft"
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gotspin7
734 posts
Dec 03, 2007
5:03 AM
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Efren, I would keep flying the bird and I don't think it is the color, (do you breed open loft?) he might be a fence jump? Maybe. I think they all come in different I get them like that all the time, I get some that are rolling almost out of the nest and then another sibling coming in at 6 months! Good Luck
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Sal Ortiz
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COYOTE33
17 posts
Dec 03, 2007
6:54 AM
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hey! el thats not a bad sign, he might be your best producer you never can tell. if all the blood around him is good, and he has all the goods give him a try.
coyote
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CSRA
649 posts
Dec 03, 2007
8:08 AM
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E i agree with all the guys above me be patience your cocks will be come a little stubborn sometime just keep a close eye out on him if you decide to breed him
Last Edited by on Dec 03, 2007 8:09 AM
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smoke747
73 posts
Dec 03, 2007
8:45 AM
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E, keep flying him. I WOULD NOT PULL HIM IN UNLESS HE HAS ALL THE GOODS. MOST IMPORTANTLY,I HAVE TO NEED HIM IN THE LOFT FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.
LONDON
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quickspin
169 posts
Dec 03, 2007
8:49 AM
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Keep flying the bird, you really don't need him as a stock because you have his parents and brothers already. Not every bird you can stock only the best should do.
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Alohazona
355 posts
Dec 03, 2007
9:04 AM
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I have to agree with Paul....The character might be alittle hard on this individual,give it time to mature.I have a black bronze hen,all her kids performed well and came into the roll late.If the bird is kitting and trapping on que,have patience.If the bird kits and is a late trapper,the character might be to hard and you could be wasting your time.Only time will tell....Aloha,Todd
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Windjammer Loft
83 posts
Dec 03, 2007
9:24 AM
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Efren....As I read all the posts. I can't say anything that hasn't already been said. I agree whole heartedly with all the guys.Its all good advise. But, I will say, you gota do what YOU think and feel is right for YOU. Use your gut feelings.
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Fly High and Roll On
Paul
Last Edited by on Dec 03, 2007 9:25 AM
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kcfirl
223 posts
Dec 03, 2007
9:32 AM
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IS it a red check, or a recessive red? If it is a red check, I believe you had another cock jump the hen. IF it is rec red, then it could be legitimate and just be a strong bird that is controlling the roll impulse. Keep flying it for another year if you have the time an perch space.
Firl
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Deadendkid
126 posts
Dec 03, 2007
12:10 PM
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efren i think the bird is a cull i would dispose of it if you keep flying him with other birds he will stop your birds from rolling you should not breed from a non performing bird we all get culls its no big thing just business as usual dispose of it the bird is just taking a perch that a spinner could be standing on this is why top flyers say cull hard
Last Edited by on Dec 03, 2007 12:12 PM
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Skylineloft
481 posts
Dec 03, 2007
12:18 PM
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sometimes those birds can be the best producer of all from a mating like that....
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Ray
Breeding Quality Spinners,
"One Roller At A Time".
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Deadendkid
128 posts
Dec 03, 2007
12:27 PM
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ray i had three cocks that only tumbled but their siblings all rolled real good i guesss i should have bred from them but i didnt i chose to stock the ones that spun my mistake i will keep a eye out for my next non roller and i will stock it and breed from it
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hectorvicki2003@yaho
100 posts
Dec 03, 2007
3:56 PM
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Efren
My old friend Bob Scott use to say,if you get a bird that dont do more than a flip after a year,comeing out of your best stock, its the bird to breed.
He use to say they where the once with control and caracter.
i myself dont like to stock a bird that dont roll.
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Hector Coya
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Ballrollers
985 posts
Dec 03, 2007
5:02 PM
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Efren,
I'm sure you have heard of the phrase, "cull hard". It means just that. Any bird who is not spinning by twelve months in my loft gets the ax. I try not to even look at pedigrees when evaluating performance. This will prejudice you in favor of certain birds that are not performing up to par and you will waste a lot of time "hoping and praying" that a bird will turn out. I only look at the pedigree after a bird has made the grade...or culled itslef, of course. Cull him and try again.
Cliff
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PR_rollers
178 posts
Dec 03, 2007
6:59 PM
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Efren .only you know your family ,no one but you can decide what to do got to go with your gut feeling,,what i do is wait but this is me, if it is kitting well and trapping give me no head ache ,them i wait but he won't fly with my A or B team i put him with the non workers that are waitng for there sentencing in life.. i use him for fostering, ,if you have the space meanwhile fly him all this time he just might surprise you..if the gene is there.. as for breeding him I'm sure you have alot of goods already,,he won't be miss..give it a year..good luck,,
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Ralph....
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luis
370 posts
Dec 03, 2007
7:00 PM
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Genetics is a funny thing Efren.Try it all so you can learn from personal experience.Just my 2 cents!
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elopez
114 posts
Dec 03, 2007
8:04 PM
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Thanks guys.
Firl - this is a rec. red.
I'm not thinking of breeding him anytime soon, I'm going to take most of the advise and continue to fly him. Hopefully he'll just be a late bloomer...
I just couldn't understand why he wasn't turning over?
I guess if I no longer had the parents then I would have stocked this bird, but I still have them and I'm making more and if they work like the others then I'll stock one of them...
Thanks again.
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Efren Lopez
SGVS
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elopez
115 posts
Dec 03, 2007
8:04 PM
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Thanks guys.
Firl - this is a rec. red.
I'm not thinking of breeding him anytime soon, I'm going to take most of the advise and continue to fly him. Hopefully he'll just be a late bloomer...
I just couldn't understand why he wasn't turning over?
I guess if I no longer had the parents then I would have stocked this bird, but I still have them and I'm making more and if they work like the others then I'll stock one of them...
Thanks again.
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Efren Lopez
SGVS
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PR_rollers
182 posts
Dec 03, 2007
8:15 PM
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Elopez,,glad you made up your mind and that we can help.. good choice you made..good luck in the game..
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Ralph....
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