DeepSpinLofts
697 posts
May 04, 2008
3:41 PM
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I think a bird has it... but not exactly sure.
I've had some young birds in the nest with what looks like food or something lodged in their throats. I tried pulling the particles out with tweezers... had some luck once.... but the other babies appeared to have suffocated or choked to death.
....well anyway
I've had 2 adult birds with the same problems only to die on me. Now I have a bird off my best cock and best hen with a puffy face and the same symptons.
QUESTION: Is there some type of medication or home remedy to save this valuable roller?
All the pet shops around here closes in 1 hour so if there's a solution for this medical problem I would like to know immediately.
{P.S.} I seriously would like to save this particular bird. The father (cock) is no longer with me and I only have the birds mother left here @ Deep Spin Lofts.
Marcus
Last Edited by on May 04, 2008 3:42 PM
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quickspin
574 posts
May 04, 2008
4:17 PM
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SPARTRIX Works great!
I have use this and works really good, takes around 3-4 days and cure.
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SALAS LOFT
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kopetsa
630 posts
May 04, 2008
4:40 PM
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I was given a pair of Jacobins that had it, so I didnt even put them in a loft, they stayed in a huge box. I took them to another pigeon breeder and he tried to get as much out of their mouth as he could. It is a cheasy kind of a yellow stuff in their mouth. After getting most out I used CANKEREX and TETRACYCLINE. You can use these if you have them around or cant get to anything else in time. But SPARTRIX is porbably the best way to go.
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Andrew
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DeepSpinLofts
698 posts
May 04, 2008
4:51 PM
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Thanks fellas.... I was started to get depressed. Good bird I'm trying to save here.
I'm going to see if the Pet Club or Petco or Petsmart has these medicines.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
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birdman
549 posts
May 04, 2008
5:23 PM
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Marcus,
Canker is the most common pigeon disease in the world!!!
You need to treat the whole flock, not just the bird showing signs of sickness.
You also need to clean and disinfect your ENTIRE loft especially the drinkers.
In the future think about treating for canker prior to putting pairs together, you'll be glad you did!
FYI, Spartrix doesn't work for all canker. You might have to use something else to get it under control.
Russ
Last Edited by on May 04, 2008 5:25 PM
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DeepSpinLofts
699 posts
May 04, 2008
7:41 PM
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That's good to know Birdman... thanks!
I'm definitely going to clean out the waterers and open up the loft to let sun inside after scrubbing some walls and other areas with bleach+water.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
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Electric-man
1548 posts
May 04, 2008
8:17 PM
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I have good luck using ACV(apple cider vinagar) this time of year! 1 TBS per gallon of water! I try to keep it in the waterers during breeding season(rainy season) and keep all of the feed picked up that comes into contact with moisture! The last two years, it been nearly non-existant in my loft!
Hope my luck holds out, should have 20 babies by this weekend!10 hatched last week and 10 more should hatch this week!
Good luck!----------
Val
"Site Moderator"
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TAWhatley
125 posts
May 04, 2008
8:27 PM
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If this is canker (and sounds like it is) Spartrix (Carnidazole) is one drug, Ronidazole is another, and Metronidazole is another. If you have no time to order a real canker drug from a pigeon supply house, then get to a pet store or fish store and look in the fish supplies for FishZole (that is Metronidazole). It is important to give the right dose to the bird, so if you end up getting FishZole from a pet store or Metronidazole from a local vet, then we need to know the strength of the drug in order to tell how much to give in one dose.
Don't try removing canker lesions .. some of them are already deeply ingrown into the tissue, and you can cause a fatal bleed by pulling them out or otherwise removing them.
Terry
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gabe454
809 posts
May 04, 2008
8:29 PM
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Spartrix
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454
TRIPLE "G" LOFT
L.P.R.C
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Electric-man
1549 posts
May 04, 2008
9:11 PM
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My ACV theory was to use as a preventative, not a cure!
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Val
"Site Moderator"
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smoke747
1022 posts
May 05, 2008
12:43 AM
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Remember, once you treat canker the organism stops shedding imediately, so get on it an treat the entire flock.
smoke747
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Keith London
ICRC
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tucknroll
32 posts
May 05, 2008
4:30 PM
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Marcus take heed to what Terry has posted he is right on the money. Don't try to emphrophise (sp) the situation. These meds are targeted to rid you of the problem. Keep in mind canker is in all pigeons it is brought out with stress and carriers. It isn't a bacteria that grows in the feces but rather transmitted by a central water dispensor or by billing and feeding of young. Are you feeding pelletts or a comercial grain? I'll bet your feeding a comercial grain mixture that has corn in it. For what ever reason the heat temperature wise in your area and the corn really blooms the canker if its suttle it will raise its ugly head that along with the stress of feeding young. How much grit do you have available to the breeders? A good mixture is a good 1/2 ration red grit 1/4 ration oyster shell and 1/3 parakeet grit. Mix that together and than add 1/3 can of a horse mineral salt mix. Thier you will have a great mix with all the nutrients they need to feed thier young and sustain thier own health in the process providing your feeding grain. Don't feed grit if your feeding pelletts FYI to the newbies that are reading. Maybe Dave Szabatura can chime in on your use of tetracycline as Dave is a Pharmicist. What about it Dave?
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DeepSpinLofts
703 posts
May 05, 2008
5:57 PM
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Now that's what I call some valuable information.
Thanks Tuck-n-Roll!
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
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TAWhatley
126 posts
May 05, 2008
11:25 PM
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Marcus,
Just following up a bit here. Neither the tetracycline or amprolium (that's for coccidiosis, I think) would be effective against canker. Canker is also known as trichomoniasis and is a protozoal infestation which requires an anti-protozoal drug to save the day and the bird.
Here is a link that also contains a rather unpleasant picture of just what the canker/trich lesions look like inside the mouth and throat of a pigeon: http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/201400.htm Canker can also appear in the vent area and is known as cloacal canker. It can also be invisible inside the bird but is doing terrible damage there and you may not have a clue that it is happening.
If you will look at the top of the message list here on Roller-Talk, you will see that Tony carries Spartrix tablets and 4 in 1 powder right off the bat. I suspect he also carries other canker products as well as the commonly used medications for other pigeon diseases. It's a good idea to have at least a little bit of a medicine chest on hand for the common things like canker, e.coli, coccidiosis, and paratyphoid (salmonellosis).
I hope you've gotten some medication for your bird and that the bird is doing OK.
Terry (I'm a female, by the way .. no offense taken by me but don't want to mislead anyone here)
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DeepSpinLofts
706 posts
May 06, 2008
3:46 AM
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Thanks a lot Terry... I am totally grateful for your input regarding this unfortunate situation I'm currently faced with.
NOTE: I'll be ordering the 4-in-1 powder today and will pay a little extra for its speedy delivery!
In regards to the link of what Canker can do to pigeons, I've seen it before and here's a link so that other domestic bird fanciers can know about Avian Pox & Pigeon Canker's detrimental effects.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
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J_Star
1578 posts
May 06, 2008
8:52 AM
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Here is some more info.
Canker (Trichomoniasis) Made Simple
By Jay Alnimer (J_Star) 2007
Canker sores are called also mouth (beak) ulcers. Canker sores are thought to form when, for unexplained reasons, a pigeon’s immune system identifies the presence of chemical molecules that it does not recognize. The presence of those molecules activates an attack by the immune system's lymphocytes (a type of white blood cell). The carnage created by the lymphocytes' attack on these unrecognized molecules results in the formation of the beak ulcers.
Causes can be of many things including:
1. EMOTIONAL STRESS or PSYCHIC STRESS is the number one cause of canker.
2. Nutritional deficiencies: deficient in Vitamin B1, B2, B6, B12 and C.
3. Allergies and sensitivities to certain feed or cereal grains such as buckwheat, wheat, barley, oats and rye, and the gluten protein found in grains.
4. Hormonal change, around breeding season.
5. Genetics, carried from generation to generation.
Pigeons have this permanently and will keep equilibrium until severely stressed. There are two main forms and over forty strains of common infectious protozoa. Throat canker which forms a soft cheesy growth may easily removed with cotton but dipped in aqueous iodine and glycerin, then treated with a standard veterinary cure. Internal Canker affecting various organs and mucosa are treated immediately with veterinary products.
All infected birds should be isolated as it is readily spread to any bird in low condition via the feed or water. Canker does not require routine treatment but maybe monitored by regular clinical inspection of feces and treated only as required. Canker equilibrium imbalance is often a secondary infection to more serious disease and is an ideal, monitor of general health. Therefore it does not make sense to attempt to completely eradicate this protozoan with routine flock treatment but only maintain a natural equilibrium within the immune system. Only treat as a cure for badly infected birds.
Symptoms of the disease:
In adult pigeons and fledglings, there is a noticeable decrease in vitality, reluctance to fly, diarrhea and reddening of the throat. As the infection progresses, “yellow buttons” appear on the palatal mucosa, developing into yellow deposits (Canker). Do not detach the deposits due to risk of bleeding. Nestlings develop an umbilical infection and an abscess is formed which can spread to the internal organs. At 10 to 14 days of age, pungent smelling liquid droppings and the first sign of retarded growth are observed, with the nestlings constantly squeaking for food.
Treatment:
During treatment period, do not provide bath water.
Emtryl is commonly used drug; this product is purchased as 40% water-soluble powder that is added to the drinking water at a rate of one level teaspoon per one gallon of water. Birds should be treated for a minimum of five days and not longer than seven days. One problem with Emtryl is that it can be poisonous. Commonly, birds are overdosed during hot weather or when they are raising youngsters because of their greater need for water consumption.
Ridzol is another product that can be used to treat pigeons or prevention of Canker. Use one teaspoon per gallon of water for five days. Ridzol is superior to any other drug because it seems to be less toxic and more effective than other comparable drugs in the treatment of prevention of Canker.
Spartrix is another product that is used to treat effected pigeons. This product comes in a tablet for individual treatment. Spartrix is very effective product.
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DeepSpinLofts
712 posts
May 06, 2008
5:08 PM
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Who sells Ridzol?
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
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birdman
553 posts
May 06, 2008
5:53 PM
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Make sure you don't give the canker meds if you are breeding. The parents could pump the squeaks full of medicated water that could overdose the young.
Also, Ridzol is a good med. but it has been proven to affect the fertility of the cock. Not recommended if you are pairing up or breeding already.
Russ
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smk
80 posts
May 06, 2008
7:07 PM
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i have used the fishzole with next day results and should be readily available
smk
rock-n-roller loft
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RUDY..ZUPPPPP
1610 posts
May 06, 2008
7:11 PM
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They told me once a bird has canker is a weak bird ????
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RUDY PAYEN
PANCHO VILLA LOFT
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Velo99
1699 posts
May 06, 2008
8:47 PM
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Rudy,
A bird in a weakened condition rather than an overall weak bird.
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V99
Keep the best. Eat the rest.
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