silent187
398 posts
Feb 12, 2009
9:25 PM
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ok when a bird starts to tail ride and drops lets say 30 feet tail riding will he most likely roll 30ft or does it still depend..??
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0221
87 posts
Feb 12, 2009
9:28 PM
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It doesn't mean anything except thats his way of resisting the roll. the bird is to strong.
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PR_rollers
GOLD MEMBER
2478 posts
Feb 12, 2009
9:29 PM
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No that bird is just tail riding if its young he will stop that that is what they do when young and starting ,a leanring phrase now if its old its a cull..
I had one that tail ride 30 ft and when it started to roll , roll only 20 ft..so that does not indicate how deep they going to be..
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Ralph
Last Edited by on Feb 13, 2009 7:47 AM
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wishiwon2
143 posts
Feb 12, 2009
9:36 PM
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I used to wonder the same thing, if tail riding correlated to mature rolling depth or frquency. A few years ago, I kept careful notes about young development and compared against mature (2 yr) traits. I found no direct relationship between tail riding and mature roll traits.
I agree with Ralph, if its a mature bird tail riding its a cullable fault.
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Jon
"had fun, wish i won 2"
If it were easy, everybody would do it ...
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silent187
399 posts
Feb 12, 2009
10:22 PM
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no i know im just wondering if it could possibly give u an idea of how much it'll roll later on....
i no if its mature to cull it
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donnie james
235 posts
Feb 13, 2009
4:22 PM
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hay silent it always happen to me what ever the bird tail ride its down to...........it rolled that for me so it might happen for you...............donny james
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silent187
403 posts
Feb 13, 2009
5:02 PM
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exactly that was my question donny... u got it
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155
965 posts
Feb 13, 2009
5:13 PM
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I HATE WHEN THEY tail riding.....
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EVILLOFT'S
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juanrollers
251 posts
Feb 13, 2009
5:19 PM
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Hey silent are you flying birds this time a year?
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silent187
404 posts
Feb 13, 2009
10:13 PM
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only old birds that didnt get to fly cause of bop last yr and two youngsters i got for free thats it..
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donnie james
241 posts
Feb 13, 2009
10:14 PM
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i got it always happen to me.................donny james
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silent187
405 posts
Feb 13, 2009
10:15 PM
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yes i think so too
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0221
94 posts
Feb 14, 2009
7:32 AM
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I'm curious to know how many of You flyer's ever had a bird be really good that tail rides.
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Windjammer Loft
699 posts
Feb 14, 2009
8:10 AM
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In all my different preformance birds,the tail riding means that shortly their after they come into the roll. How far they tail ride has "no" bearing on how deep they will roll.
Fly High and Roll On
Paul
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0221
95 posts
Feb 14, 2009
8:34 AM
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Paul, I agree, but wouldn't you sooner see one just flip over really fast in the begining than to tail ride. My experience has been that birds that tail ride are trying to resist the roll and not many will commit to the roll, as they get older and very stiff. What do you think?
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Windjammer Loft
701 posts
Feb 14, 2009
8:46 AM
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0221...all I can tell you is what my birds do. I know for a fact that when one of my young birds start to tail ride,usually within a 7 to 10 days after,I notice they start to attemtp and do start roll.. Not all my birds tail ride. Some go right into the roll and some do some tail riding.
Fly High and Roll On
Paul
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0221
96 posts
Feb 14, 2009
8:58 AM
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Paul, So do you notice any difference in your birds that started out tail rideing and the one's that didn't after they mature in your family?
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Scott
1736 posts
Feb 14, 2009
10:09 AM
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I get a few within thier first days of flight then they quit, I did have a bird a few years ago go all the way to the ground with it from a few hundred feet,it never did it again though and turned into just a sloppy Roller.
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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quickspin
992 posts
Feb 14, 2009
10:21 AM
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Out of the ones I have now I have not seen one tail ride.
When I was a kid most of my birds tail ride.
I don't know why is that.
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®SALAS LOFT
I.C.R.C
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silent187
406 posts
Feb 14, 2009
2:16 PM
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yeah mines were tail riding now they starting to do small rolls and tail ride a lil after so yeah soon they should be rolling...
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wishiwon2
148 posts
Feb 14, 2009
10:53 PM
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0221,
I didnt record how they performed quality wise in my experiment I mentioned above, I only recorded depth. I do believe however, that those tailriders didnt make top quality. As I look back over those records, none of the birds I marked for any tail-riding depth have been used as stock. I also have noticed in the evolution of my family that I have far fewer tail sitters now that 5 or 6 years ago.
I do know for sure that my best birds are those that start out at about 6-8 mo. with quick flips, then 5-10 feet over the next few weeks. My youngsters as they develope will initially roll with alot of frequency and sometimes real deep 40-60 ft. They then go dormant, and almost entirely stop rolling for month or more. When they start rolling again, it is a more tight, hard mature type spin. At this point, the good ones show control, varying depth and frequency as conditions allow, and the others show issues if they have them. This maturing change usually comes on about 10-14 months old. Those that tail ride out of a roll, (at the end) are culls. I think they're bodies lock up, just like a rolldown except they arent beating their wings.
Depth of tailride doesnt equal depth of roll. Being a tailrider is no promise that it will become a roller.
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Jon
"had fun, wish i won 2"
If it were easy, everybody would do it ...
Last Edited by on Feb 14, 2009 11:03 PM
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RodSD
187 posts
Feb 15, 2009
12:13 AM
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Interesting observation Jon. I suppose that young rollers go to some sort of phases. Since they are still growing and developing the first year I suppose their neurobiology is changing as well.
Do people have observed their adult rollers (1 year old or older) tail-rding after a very long lock down? Obviously not all of them, but few.
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0221
99 posts
Feb 15, 2009
4:25 AM
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wishiwon2,
I like your discription, the only thing I would add about My family is that the 30 to 45 footers shorten up to 20 to 25 foot and get faster with age. i'm pretty selective with mine, but I do try to stock one each year.
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Windjammer Loft
703 posts
Feb 15, 2009
5:19 AM
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0221...like I said, the tail riding has nothing to do with the depth of roll. It just shows me that some birds need alittle more time and encouragement to roll...lol
I really don't pay any attention to what my bird does as a youngster,as to how "soon" they come into the roll. I know at what age they should be rolling. Thats where I pay attention. I guess that's the "more" important thing to "know"
wishiwon2 has the right idea "you" have to know your birds
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Fly High and Roll On
Paul
Last Edited by on Feb 15, 2009 5:28 AM
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0221
101 posts
Feb 15, 2009
5:29 AM
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Paul, I'm not argueing with you, I was just saying, When I had young birds that tail ride verse's just snap a quick flip. In My family the one's that tail ride weren't as good and never really became keeper's.I was just asking to see if anyone else noticed that in there family.
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Windjammer Loft
705 posts
Feb 15, 2009
5:40 AM
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0221........not a problem. I don't look at our conversation as an "arguement" at all... As a matter of fact it's been along time since I have been able to have a conversation with a fancier here ,that didn't want to
"argue"....lol. I enjoy talking to guys like yourself and others. Hope to continue this type of talk. Thanks
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Fly High and Roll On
Paul
Last Edited by on Feb 15, 2009 5:42 AM
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spinningdemon
354 posts
Feb 15, 2009
7:49 AM
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I raised one this year that would tail ride down from 200' to get to the feed can. So some will tail ride for other reasons. I still culled the bird, since it brought the kit down early to many times.
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David Curneal
www.freewebs.com/dcurneal
www.saltcreekcustomstone.com
In the air since 1973
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PR_rollers
GOLD MEMBER
2494 posts
Feb 15, 2009
8:25 AM
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Yup David if it tail ride for feed its a cull to me too.got to have rolling in your mind feed second...
tail riding in a mature bird to me its a bird that can't put the brakes on when rolling to snap out of the roll and loses control and lock its self until its mind get a grip on what its doing to resume back to flying... .
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Ralph
Last Edited by on Feb 15, 2009 9:15 AM
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silent187
409 posts
Feb 15, 2009
8:44 AM
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ohh kool but i noticed the ones that do tail ride usually roll no more then 30ft ever that ive had... after they mature the roll... so maybe tail riding really aint good...
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PR_rollers
GOLD MEMBER
2497 posts
Feb 15, 2009
9:18 AM
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Tail riding is just that.rolling on its arse..see that birds Scott talk about above busted a hemorrhoid...
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Ralph
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