George R.
1412 posts
Mar 27, 2009
8:38 PM
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What if anything do you think of this eye ?
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fresnobirdman
552 posts
Mar 27, 2009
8:42 PM
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looks good,
but those eyes look scary in solid black birds,
had a black hen with eyes like that, scared my little sister,lol.
-fou
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donnie james
352 posts
Mar 27, 2009
9:10 PM
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very good a good sign it looks................donny james
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TT
GOLD MEMBER
396 posts
Mar 27, 2009
9:52 PM
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Powerful.
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Tony...
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Bill C
303 posts
Mar 27, 2009
10:06 PM
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I think the eye has to do with the whole birds expression and charactor. Does it watch you when you are 10 to 15 feet away from the loft. Some watch you and some just live in LA La Land all day. I was rotatilling today and some would watch me go this way and that way. Others could careless what all that noise was about.
I dont think the eye in and of itself does much good. It looks nice to me but what does that mean? I like birds that look spaced out and with a large eye ceres around the eye. But it has to go with the rest of the bird in a compelenting way showing the bird is alert and inteligent and then you have all the rest, body type and performance.
The wings can show some goods. THin primarys and when they are rolling they can be bent back in certain areas. I have never posted a picture maybe I could put on a wing or two? Didnt mean to hi jack your post though. Nice Betty Davis eyes! Bill C
Last Edited by on Mar 27, 2009 10:08 PM
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JDA
GOLD MEMBER
213 posts
Mar 27, 2009
10:40 PM
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Bill C-Your birds don,t tip there head up and look at that 747 flying above the clouds? Or that BOP up high where it is just a spot in the sky? Or how about that overfly and making it back by landmarks? Or that cat coming over the fence.In comp they see where to start there brake and where to end it.Eye sign is very important.JDA
Last Edited by on Mar 27, 2009 10:52 PM
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Shadow
367 posts
Mar 28, 2009
12:12 AM
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If al else is right with this bird,it would be a breeding loft specialist
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nicksiders
GOLD MEMBER
3353 posts
Mar 28, 2009
12:59 AM
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If it has another eye on the other side of its head, it is a good sign that this bird is okay......that my friends is eye signing.
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Just My Take On Things
Nick Siders
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Ty Coleman
603 posts
Mar 28, 2009
6:42 AM
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Nick, for once im my life I agree with you, lol
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Ty
Vapor Trail Lofts
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gotspin7
2348 posts
Mar 28, 2009
8:45 AM
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George, all you want from your birds is a nice clear eye and not a cloudy one. All the other stuff about eye sign is BS! At least in my personal opinion. Good luck bro.
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Sal Ortiz
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JDA
GOLD MEMBER
214 posts
Mar 28, 2009
9:59 AM
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gotspin7- And your personal opinion is based on ?????JDA
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gotspin7
2350 posts
Mar 28, 2009
10:02 AM
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JDA, my personal opinion is based on my experience with these birds. Eyes are only good to look out of and that is about it. I hope this helps your question.
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Sal Ortiz
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gotspin7
2351 posts
Mar 28, 2009
12:26 PM
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JDA, never owned one and don't care for them. I do have friends that do well with them. Now what does that have to do with rollers?
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Sal Ortiz
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c robbo
477 posts
Mar 28, 2009
12:42 PM
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my birds had the same eye has that...i love the oringe eye...dont like the pearl eye thay seem to be to a rattik.
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JDA
GOLD MEMBER
217 posts
Mar 28, 2009
2:37 PM
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gotspin7-(I do have friends that do well with them.) Ask them what they think about eye sign. You should think the same way. For a roller is to look and feel like a miniature racing homer. Thats from Bill Pensom writings.If you were to look at the eyes of birds from J Higgins for example, you would see expression plus, Green and yellow rings around the pupal. That is eye sign. JDA
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gotspin7
2352 posts
Mar 28, 2009
4:08 PM
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JDA, don't get it twisted bud... I know what eye sign is, my question to you is how does it really help you look at a better roller or in this case make a better roller? To me that is just what you like or favor in eye sign and nothing more.
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Sal Ortiz
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JDA
GOLD MEMBER
218 posts
Mar 28, 2009
4:40 PM
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gotspin7-Enjoy your birds. JDA
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Sunflower
GOLD MEMBER
365 posts
Mar 28, 2009
6:34 PM
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Sal,
I'm with you!
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Keep em Spinning
Joe
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PR_rollers
GOLD MEMBER
2798 posts
Mar 28, 2009
7:50 PM
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Jay I'm with Sal on this one too >"how does it really help you look at a better roller or in this case make a better roller"?
----------Don't want the newbie getting confuse about eye sign .I have a bird who I look at times and say this bird can't be any good he doesn't have that rich intelligent look in his eyes but this birds has more frequency and quality than the others birds that have the rich eyes.. I'm mean this bird has a dull look .but when he is up there in the sky he has a rich look ..now you think birds have expression in there eyes you should see my eyes when he rolls ..excitement...
Ralph.
miss opportunity are the curse of potential well if opportunity is not knocking you build the door...
Last Edited by on Mar 31, 2009 10:22 AM
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Windjammer Loft
763 posts
Mar 29, 2009
1:05 AM
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I too have to agree with Ralph and Sal. Eyes in Rollers are only for looking out of.... Now racers are a different story..
Fly High and Roll On
Paul
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Shadow
368 posts
Mar 29, 2009
2:02 AM
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We all have traits in our birds which please us and displeases us to certain degrees,size,shape,etc,tail colours,all many differing traits,and the ones we choose to believe in ,we are more than happy to see in abundance,why not treat the eye as another trait,study it,see does it hold up to your scrutiny as far as progress within your birds are concerned but don't be a Luddite,knocking something with out even trying it,get a loop study the eye of a good spinner,likewise the pair thas producing them,as against a pair that does not/has not,its a fact,most that knock eye sign know damn all about it,if its not for you,state why,not something akin,they are only good for looking out of,an eye sign has very little to do with colour in pigeons,of which there are but two basic colours,yellow and white/pearl,just a little tale here part of the n.a.s.a astronaut selection is eye sign based,why so ask yourself,and for me any way,its a yellow eyed based family that will lst the distance,long after the predominant white/pearl eyed one has hit the wall,earlier I said treat it loke a trait,but its really a genitic link
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harrison
563 posts
Mar 29, 2009
3:14 AM
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I have a red oddside cock and one of his eyes is pure black (ODD EYE)
People say this is bcause birds with alot of white on them they tend to get this?
I can tell you this bird his one heck of a roller and also a good producer.
I am having trouble understanding what the birds eyes have to do with there performance.
Yes if you are a show breeder you will have to have that perfect eye of course.
But appart from that it means Nothing,Nothing at all.
Yours in roll harrison.
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LittleJohn
51 posts
Mar 29, 2009
4:39 AM
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Looks good.
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Ty Coleman
608 posts
Mar 29, 2009
6:00 AM
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If it's the right type in the air then to me it's the right type. Keel,eye,color,tailflex or any other hoax.
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Ty
Vapor Trail Lofts
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nicksiders
GOLD MEMBER
3355 posts
Mar 29, 2009
8:34 AM
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The eyes are a good indicator of health and intellegence. They have nothing to do with performance. Many racing homer guys are also recognizing that eye signing is nothing more than hokis-pokis nonsense. It will change with each new winner.
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Just My Take On Things
Nick Siders
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BA Rollers
215 posts
Mar 29, 2009
8:17 PM
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Based solely on that photo, I say its a rolldown or a bird with way too much heat.
I've paid attention to the eyes off and on over the years. I have three families and the tendencies in all three are all the same. The good ones have a completely normal eye, nothing oustanding about them, no outstanding expression to them. Just look like pigeons when they are on the perch or in a show pen. The ones that have something noticable about their eyes are generally (for me) the ones that are either too stiff, too hot or don't want to kit.
The only thing I buy about the racing homer eye studies are the advantage of seeing the potential vitality of the bird.
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Scott
1964 posts
Mar 29, 2009
8:25 PM
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Brian I was thinking the same with that forward dropped pupil, I have a late hatch with the richest wild looking pearl eye,it hasn't came in yet but everytime I look at I think "how can this not be loaded with roll" .
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Just my Opinion
Scott
Last Edited by on Mar 29, 2009 8:30 PM
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George R.
1413 posts
Mar 29, 2009
8:27 PM
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Bingo mr. B.A.
this pigeon was webbed toed inbred to the MAX.
He was a Borges pigeon and was way to HOT.
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SiDLoVE
391 posts
Mar 29, 2009
8:42 PM
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George, Do you still have the bird? Can you check pupil reaction. Put the eye in the light then the shade and see how fast the pupil opens and closes and tell us how fast or slow this birds pupil reaction is . Thanks
Sidlove
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DeepSpinLofts
1297 posts
Mar 29, 2009
9:21 PM
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George.... eyes look healthy and so do the ceres.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
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city-side-lofts
282 posts
Mar 30, 2009
8:57 PM
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what I have found out in rollers is normally if the pupal sits to far forward the bird will be a roll down I have noticed this and it is true to a point I have had one bird that never rolled down but it produced nothing but roll downs so I culled it and I am very weary about birds with the pupal sitting to far forward now
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The man in black
Bling-Bling-Benny-Boy
city-side-lofts.piczo.com
Rocket-Rollers
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city-side-lofts
283 posts
Mar 30, 2009
8:57 PM
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what I have found out in rollers is normally if the pupal sits to far forward the bird will be a roll down I have noticed this and it is true to a point I have had one bird that never rolled down but it produced nothing but roll downs so I culled it and I am very weary about birds with the pupal sitting to far forward now
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The man in black
Bling-Bling-Benny-Boy
city-side-lofts.piczo.com
Rocket-Rollers
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Electric-man
2282 posts
Mar 30, 2009
9:35 PM
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My first thought was that the bird looked kinda "bug eyed", or spooked. I don't like this look myself. I like a bird that looks a bit more calm. Not an intellegent looking bird in my opinion.
Interesting about the forward pupil, I didn't notice that the first time I looked at it.
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Val
Last Edited by on Mar 30, 2009 9:41 PM
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Shadow
370 posts
Mar 31, 2009
3:51 AM
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The birds eye looks too far forward because it is looking that way,this is evident by the ratio of its iris that's showing between top and bottom,the pupil should always be in the the centre of its iris,if not its got an eye deformity
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c robbo
479 posts
Mar 31, 2009
4:47 AM
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the eye is more breeder than show eye.
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nicksiders
GOLD MEMBER
3360 posts
Mar 31, 2009
7:12 AM
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After re-examaning my attitude about all the stuff like eye sign; tail flex and the rest of the stuff that many cast off as a hoax (like me) I think many of these things may have merit in moving us from good rollers to excellent rollers. I am beginning to understand that the bird has to have all of the tools off the perch to give you that performance in the air that would be considered as excellence. Size, shape, some back skull; flexibility; length; etc.....all of it has to be there for the performance to be there.
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Just My Take On Things
Nick Siders
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
3196 posts
Mar 31, 2009
8:47 AM
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Hey Nick, I think it is interesting to note that competitive swimmers are always looking for ways to cut resistance in the water; one new swimsuit I recently read about actually has buoyancy engineered into it, keeping more of the swimmer out of the water where resistance is lowered just enough so that many swimming records have been broken by swimmers wearing it.
This suit is having such an impact on the sport that the ruling swimming authorities are considering its ban from competitive swimming.
So for me, I think it is perfectly within reason to consider that a smaller roller with good tail-flex (the ability to bend the tail closer to the back) creates less wind resistance and therefore will spin faster than if the same bird where longer and could not bend its tail back in the same way.
My view of the tail is that in the roll, it is like a sail, it catches wind and effects wind speed and direction. To what degree is rolling enhanced or hurt by tail-flex? Perhaps only slightly either way, but it is only one trait among several that when considered for breeding stock, certainly does not hurt the birds ability to roll and it is an effort to breed closer to the aerial standard.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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Velo99
2075 posts
Mar 31, 2009
11:40 AM
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Umm JDA
Where did WHP say a roller is supposed to be like a miniature homer?
A) homers have no tail flex.
B) homers dont roll.
C) homers are racers(fast flyers).
You can have miniature homers.
I`ll take rollers.
yits
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V99
blue sky single beat
in cadance performing now
earth beckons the winged
drawn breath is let quickly forth
orchestral movement follows
___ ~_____
\__\_/-|_| \__\____
/()_)__14___()_)\__\
Last Edited by on Mar 31, 2009 11:41 AM
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Velo99
2076 posts
Mar 31, 2009
11:42 AM
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T
I always thought a bird with a "crooked tail" would have a tendency to not roll straight.
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V99
blue sky single beat
in cadance performing now
earth beckons the winged
drawn breath is let quickly forth
orchestral movement follows
___ ~_____
\__\_/-|_| \__\____
/()_)__14___()_)\__\
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JDA
GOLD MEMBER
220 posts
Mar 31, 2009
6:01 PM
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v99- You should read what I said not what you thank I said. Should look an feel like a miniature racing homer. JDA
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Scott
1968 posts
Mar 31, 2009
6:18 PM
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Kenny , how much does a tail have to flex to have the illusion of balling up ? the still shots that I've seen of fine birds in the roll show that it isn't much.
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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