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The Original All Roller Talk Discussion Board Archive >
How Much To Feed?
How Much To Feed?
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 17, 2004
9:43 AM
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Hello all, I would like to keep the birds(flying rollers) in air for about 30 minutes or more. I have tried both little less tablespoon or little more tablespoon feed per day per bird however not working out.
If I feed less they come back with in 3 minutes if more then they fly for about 6 minutes and land back. I am feeding wheat and milo 50/50 to flying kit. Any input would be greatly appreciated.
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 17, 2004
2:20 PM
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Well Anonymous Guest,
Thats sounds corny LOL whats your name? LOL
Try this:
Mix your feed 1/3 wheat 1/3 milo and 1/3 peas either Canadian or trapper.
Start with 2 cups of this mix next feeding. Call this day1
Fly them the next day and give them 1 and 1/2 cup of this mix 30 minutes after they get in the kit box.Call this day 2.
Day 3 rest em. Give em 1 and 1/2 cups of mix.
Day 4 fly em and see how they start to change.
If they fly longer waite 30 min. and give 2 cups.
Day 5 rest em and give em 1 and 1/2 cups of mix.
They should be stronger and flying longer.
Do this on a rotation to keep your kit rested and not flying the roll out of your birds.(Fly a day- Rest a day)
"Pay Strict Attention " and if they start to get to high cut the feed back" 1/2 a cup at a time to bring them back down.
The main thing is not to have an overfly when they get to fly fit.
I won't explain the use of Milo to get them ready for competetion you need to get a handle on your birds first.
Hope this helps.
Steve S.
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Feb 17, 2004
5:45 PM
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Feed them birds MORE!!!!!!! they need what they need,age,family,temps,it all plays in,more guys are sucked into that tablespoon,thats only a general guide,very general.
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 17, 2004
8:24 PM
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what ever you feed feed more
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 18, 2004
11:04 AM
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Jay is here. Thanks all for reply. I will take picture of cups I am using to feed birds and post it here. So you guys can take a look and guide me if I am using right cups to feed flying birds.
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 18, 2004
3:35 PM
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Hello Guys, I have added the pictures to yahoo briefcase. Please go to link below and click on pigeons directory
http://briefcase.yahoo.com/
There you will find cups I bought for feed flying rollers
Here is what written on cups
1 CUP = 250 ML
1/2 CUP = 125 ML
1/3 CUP = 80 ML
1/4 CUP = 60 ML
My question is which cup I used to feed 20 birds kit. Also when you say 2 CUPs which cup you referring?
Thanks for looking
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 18, 2004
3:36 PM
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Sorry, here is correct link
http://briefcase.yahoo.com/rollersloft
Thanks
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Feb 18, 2004
6:13 PM
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Man this isnt Rocket science dont complicate it,I use two things for feeding,a small soup can and a big soup can,all these are are for referance,I use the smaller one when its mild,the bigger one when its cold,from there I regulate it,when they are young they are growing and need lots,when they are slow at trapping then they get cut back,once they start maturing then they are fed per flytime and wt.,your birds tell you what they need by haldling them and thier reaction,NO ONE CAN TELL YOU HOW MUCH TO FEED,and what works this week can change on you quick if the temps either rise or fall,but handle your birds,that will tell you if you are underfeeding,here's an example,in summer my old birds do fine on 7/8 ths of the small can,winter they need the big can,depending on how cold it is,in some parts of the country they may need a can and a half or more when its cold,also it's an up and down proccess,they never get exactly the same amount day by day,the more they fly the more they need,the less you fly the less they need,also,Wheat/milo or wheat,is good in the spring and summer but NOT in the winter or moult,they need a richer feed and more fat,thats the best that I can explaine it,learn your birds,but I know one thing and that is if you are feeding them as you say and unless you live in a very mild part of the country them birds have to be hurting and you need to pack some wt.on them. hope this helps
Scott Campbell
you know what,give me a call,it'll be easier 209 772-3445
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rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
43 posts
Feb 18, 2004
7:31 PM
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Try this, it is EASY. This is an excerpt from my publication "HOW TO BREED BETTER ROLLERS" available on this site. This is a great process to tweak fly times to down to 1 or 2 minutes. (other conditions notwithstanding)
"Step 5:
Training Holdover Birds
Kit to fly 20 to 25 minutes, no more, no less. They should be very active as a group in order to maximize the point scoring window of opportunity during competition..
Continue the good habits you have established. Continue controlling the amount of time your Holdover Kit fly’s; 20-25 Minutes (or time you are shooting for).
First Day:
1: Release Kit and get to air as quickly as possible.
2: Record Length of Kit Flying Time after landing.
3: Place completely full feed tray with wheat (or your
mix)only in Kit Box. Allow birds to eat un-interrupted
for 3 minutes.
4: Record this feeding time.
Second Day:
1: Release Kit and get to air as quickly as possible.
2: Record Length of Kit Flying Time after landing.
3: Place completely full feed tray with wheat (or your mix)
only in Kit Box. Allow birds to eat un-interrupted for
2.5 minutes.
4: Record this feeding time.
Third Day:
1: Release Kit and get to air as quickly as possible
2: Record Kit and get to air as quickly as possible.
3: Place completely full feed tray with wheat (or your mix)
only in kit box. Allow birds to eat un-interrupted for 2
minutes.
4: Record this feeding time.
Continue this Training process each day. Control Fly Time by increasing or decreasing the feeding time. Begin using 15-second time increments instead of the 30 seconds intervals as you approach the ideal 20 Minute Fly Time (or whatever time you are shooting for).
Should an individual bird not do well with this training process and it is not a candidate for breeding, cull it. Rollers that don’t fit the system, will only cause distraction and take away time and effort from those birds that deserve it more.
They will also lower your scores on Fly day and reduce your chance for victory on the day of competition. Again, think 80/20 Rule.
Training For Maximum Performance
Once you have your Kit/s flying time under tight control, try some experiments in an effort to stimulate more action.
Example: Try adjusting feed times on predetermined days and score their action the following day. Find the right feed time combinations that will best suit your family of Rollers.
Whatever you do, keep written records to provide documentation for future reference. Analyze your results for possible improvements. Incorporate feeding innovations into your regular training program.
Give your Kit a chance to win by preparing well in advance of a Competition Fly. This preparation and training will give you an advance notice of any potential problems with your Kit or Training procedures.
Do this by setting up a regular Training Week well in advance of a competition to have your Kit well prepared for the competition. Remember, “simplicity through repetition”.
The week preceding a competition should seem just like any other because of your constant preparations and regular training program.
You want everything you and your Rollers do in the weeks and days approaching the big day to become “routine” or simple.
Gradually lower or increase feeding time until you have them always fly just over twenty minutes but where they want to come down just shortly after that. This requires documenting flying and feeding times on a regular basis.
Become proficient in the actions you take because where preparation meets opportunity,success can’t be far behind."
I do this and it works for me all the time. I found this process more effective as the birds flew as long as I wanted them to fly.
I had my feed times down to about 2:00 to 2:15 seconds. Step 1 is to determine a benchmark. Be sure to fly at same time each day. I would experiment with the water but I just hate to see an animal want water and be able to get it. Thats just me though.
This is really really easy. All you need is a watch with stop watch feature to do it.
Tony Chavarria
Last Edited by rollerpigeon on Feb 18, 2004 7:35 PM
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 18, 2004
7:41 PM
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If your birds are trap broke good.I start with a soup can that holds one and a half cups of wheat when full.Give 2 of these about 3 cups then fly the next day watch how long they fly.Do this till the birds get to about 35 or 40 min then drop to 1 can till their fly time is about 15 to 20 min then start to add a little till they get back to about the time YOU want them in the air.Like Scott said it changes almost every day watch them fly and then ajust.
Their is nothing written in stone its try and try agin..
Good luck.
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Feb 18, 2004
8:41 PM
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Another thing,very important,and thats the size of the tray,MAKE SURE THAT ITS PLENTY BIG ENOUGH FOR ALL THE BIRDS to eat out of without to much of a scramble,so much of this is nothing more than common sence
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rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
51 posts
Feb 18, 2004
9:04 PM
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Motherlode, you are right, it is common sense for you and me but for the new guys they have not had a chance to learn it, its a little tougher sometimes when there is no reference point or benchmark to work with.
I would rather they ask, but sometimes the issue can get overly complicated. lol
Tony Chavarria
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Feb 18, 2004
11:03 PM
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Tony it's good to see you posting here (seeing it's your site LOL),Tony I threw that common sence thing out for no one in general but only to point out that there are no secrets,and heck yea if you don't know ask,that tablespoon measurement has come up so many times with new guys,as far as the feed tray I've seen it over and over again a kit of 20 birds being fed in a tray thats godod for only 10-15 birds,you also want the team to have a cool off period before feeding,I like about 20 min,same with feed,wheat/milo or straight wheat,my birds are hard birds,my old birds could darn near live off of wheat fumes in the summer,but only for a period of time,and one thing that has to be remembered is that wheat,and exspecially milo are weak as far as feed go,milo has a lot of air in it,no density,I feed a lot of wheat,but they also need a rich feed here and there,in other words you dont feed just wheat or wheat/milo all the time day in and day out,and you have to be carefull with youngbirds as they are growing,I mix all my own,this way I can vary the richness of the feed,or I can go straight wheat or up the protein a bit by addng some austrian peas,or add fat say in the moult with salfflour,another thing to,birds getting to fit will sky and fly long on you even when you cut the feed because they just get bouyont,when this happens it's time put them up and put the weight back on them,and that will bring the ht. and fly time back down,it seems that anything that does one particular thing will over time reverse on you and do the complete opposite if you keep doing it,it's a moving target as far as feed,condition ect.
Scott Campbell
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 19, 2004
7:28 AM
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Thanks all for the feedback. Believe it or not I am more confused then before, Soup cans, 8 OZ, 240 ML, 250 ML...however will try each and see what work for me.
Another thing you guys mentioned wait until 20 or 30 minutes and then feed. The question is if there is no feed try in the kit box they would not trap in and get on the gound and pick things up...is that ok? I noticed most of my birds do not trap in if there is no feed tray in kit box...smart I guess
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Mother lode lofts
Guest
Feb 19, 2004
7:49 AM
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Call me,over the phone would be much easier
Scott Campbell
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Steve S.
Guest
Feb 19, 2004
1:11 PM
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Jay,
As Scott said its not rocket science.
But you have to start with enough feed and adjust.
Just use one of the measureing cups ole Mom used LOL.
Throw alittle milo in the tray to get em to get in the kit box.Waite 20 or 30 minutes to cool down then give em all the feed.
Open door traing is called the English system.
The open door training is best and not use traps.
The birds get used to you and think you are the feed can.
You get to observe your birds and make any adjustments on individual birds.
Also the preditors such a cats hawks,coons,opossums and owls cant get in the kit box. If you use traps it will happen if you forget to lock the trap doors.
After you get a handle on your birds Scotts 100% correct you have to feed for the temp changes and moult.
Later
Steve S.
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 20, 2004
6:46 AM
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Thanks all for your help.
Just let me know one thing...
1 CUP which is standard and found in grocery stores is EQUAL TO WHAT when we talk around feeding rollers?
8 OZ?
4 OZ?
250 ML?
240 ML?
125 ML?
Roller guys use term "1 CUP" of feed but tell me how much feed it can hold and correct size....
I know in winter I should give two Cups of feed to 20 Birds. So two Cups = 16 OZ? or 8 OZ or 500 ML or 480
There are many other factors you guy mentioned above but this is just to get thing moving first...adjustments come later
I am new in rollers, I know you guys have gained lot of experience, the question is not that difficult
"WHAT is 1 CUP EQUAL TO"?
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rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
52 posts
Feb 20, 2004
7:51 AM
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U.S. Measurement Equivalents
A few grains/pinch/dash, etc. (dry) = Less than 1/8 tsp
A dash (liquid) = A few drops
3 teaspoons = 1 tablespoon
1/2 tablespoon = 1-1/2 teaspoons
1 tablespoon = 3 teaspoons
2 tablespoons = 1 fluid ounce
4 tablespoons = 1/4 cup
5-1/3 tablespoons = 1/3 cup
8 tablespoons = 1/2 cup
8 tablespoons = 4 fluid ounces
10-2/3 tablespoons = 2/3 cup
12 tablespoons = 3/4 cup
16 tablespoons = 1 cup
16 tablespoons = 8 fluid ounces
1/8 cup = 2 tablespoons
1/4 cup = 4 tablespoons
1/4 cup = 2 fluid ounces
1/3 cup = 5 tablespoons plus 1 teaspoon
1/2 cup = 8 tablespoons
1 cup = 16 tablespoons
1 cup = 8 fluid ounces
1 cup = 1/2 pint
2 cups = 1 pint
2 pints = 1 quart
4 quarts (liquid) = 1 gallon
Here are US measurements.
Go with my steps mentioned above. Use the 3 minutes as your "benchmark" and you can more or less forget about all these measures (if you do, your next question becomes like this...what about grain density, nutritional value of the grain, etc...
If you dig deeper then expect the responses to get more complicated. Have to assk yourself how deep do you want to go?
Use the stop watch. Watch the performance and time in air. Record it. Make your adjustments from there.
So...
What are you doing right now as far as feeding? Have you "tried" any suggestions offerred yet?
FLY ON!
Tony Chavarria
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Anonymous
Guest
Feb 20, 2004
9:35 AM
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No, I did not try any thing yet...more into which cup to use. So according to your message "1 CUP = 16 Tablespoons" I should use cup label as "1 CUP = 250 ML" for 20 birds correct? Thanks again for give me conversion information
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J T
6 posts
Dec 30, 2006
1:29 PM
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I agree
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