jim
249 posts
Jul 26, 2009
9:59 PM
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Hi everybody,
I would like your input on this
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Jim "Mason"
http://www.devilear-roller.co.za
Member of NBRC
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donnie james
615 posts
Jul 27, 2009
4:06 PM
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myself i thought though the years (36) its a man gene and though time man made it tighter and faster and that's what we got today .................donny james
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Jerry Allen
GOLD MEMBER
355 posts
Jul 28, 2009
10:28 AM
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Why Do Pigeons Roll?
A Million Dollar question!
All we have at this time are 2 cent answers.
Genetic?
Why would one nest mate roll & the other one don’t?
A true answer may never be found.
Too many variables for a correct analysis.
Ask 100 men and receive 200 different answers.
Maybe one day we will find Doctor Doolittle,
or Mr. Pigeon Whisper.
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jim
250 posts
Jul 29, 2009
1:25 AM
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OK people lets see if we can be serious about this. How can a bird roll at one stage and then stop? How do we get them back into the roll? I use a seven day program to purge the birds. After the program they roll deeper and more frequent. Let’s make this a discussion that we can learn from each other.
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Jim "Mason"
http://www.devilear-roller.co.za
Member of NBRC
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Windjammer Loft
864 posts
Jul 29, 2009
5:16 AM
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Jim... Would you explain how your program works?? I think many of us would be interested in hearing about it... I know I am... To my understanding the birds have a gene that makes them spin.
Fly High and Roll On
Paul
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jim
251 posts
Jul 29, 2009
6:06 AM
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To purch pigeons
Day one: Half a teaspoon bicarb in one litre water
Day two: One teaspoon epson salts in 1 litre water
Day three: One teaspoon tramesil in 1 litre water
Day four: One teaspoon garlic in 2 litre water
Day five: One mil virokill in 1 litre water
Day six: Electrolite in water
Day seven: 1ml Lucelsiadire in 1 litre water
And then u start 7 day training
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Jim "Mason"
http://www.devilear-roller.co.za
Member of NBRC
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iride
38 posts
Jul 29, 2009
9:43 AM
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Handlebar loft
Mike
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iride
39 posts
Jul 29, 2009
9:55 AM
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Back many years ago I experimented with a seizure drug on a few of my rollers, Is the roll controlled ?
The drug was Dilantin for the control of Grand mal seizures. All my notes are sense all long gone, I had a bird that could not fly up to a perch, When given Dilantin The bird stopped rolling down, Even when hand tossed, But he would not fly, He would just fly back to the loft,,,,,
Mike
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Handlebar loft
Mike
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iride
40 posts
Jul 29, 2009
9:59 AM
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oh, Yea, I think our good birds, The real spinners, The fast balls in the air, The birds have a controlled GRAND MAL SEIZURE..
Mike
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Handlebar loft
Mike
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
3481 posts
Jul 29, 2009
12:36 PM
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What makes a roller roll? Let's use a bit of logic and see what we get. Since we don't "train" a roller to roll, it has nothing to do with color, crossing with other breeds lowers or eliminates the propensity to roll, breeding with other rollers tends to maintain the trait, it's not something they develop to avoid bop...certain breeding practices tend to accentuate the trait...I go with its a gene. This roll gene might also being affected by other genes or lack of genes so that the roll might improve or deteriorate.
When a trait is shown to pass from one generation to another, it is in the animals gene-pool.
BTW, in Paul Gomez's book "Roller Dreams and Realities" on pages 1,2 and 3, he references wild birds that have been known roll:
* Crows
* Raven
* English sparrow
* Western Kingbirds
* Scissortailed Flycatcher
If it was a defect, nature would have eliminated it in wild birds. What would happen if these type of birds could be controlled bred? Could the roll gene be amplified?
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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J_Star
2038 posts
Jul 29, 2009
1:02 PM
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It gets half of it from the hen and the other half from the cock. If the progeny gets one full dose from the hen and one full dose from the cock, you get a rolldown. If the progeny gets half a dose from the hen and half a dose from the cock, you get a reasonably good roller. If the progeny get only one half from either the hen or the cock, you get a mediocre roller, stiff or a tumbler.
Jay
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RodSD
306 posts
Jul 29, 2009
11:18 PM
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They were bred that way. I suppose someone saw a bird that rolled and wanted that trait so he/she breed those birds more and got more. Obviously,it is genetic because the traits can be pass to the next generations. I don't like to use the word genetic defect. It is better to use the word mutations because mutations might give added advantage to the organism or quite the opposite.
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toronto15
259 posts
Jul 30, 2009
3:20 PM
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I believe it is a trait that was developed,by some species of Columbidae,ions ago,as a defensive survival mechanism to elude and escape prey.Whatever the prey was at the time has also evolved into a faster species.JMO.Glen.
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Scott
2429 posts
Jul 30, 2009
4:07 PM
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Why don't they knock of 40 fters with control from their first flight ?
Why do the good ones hammer a hard 30-40 footer once at a safe ht. only to tumble or flip when low over the roof ?
Why will the good ones shut off the roll completly when a pred is on their tail ?
This is the stuff that makes it such a facinating breed for me, not the over done retards that can't resist rolling.
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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toronto15
261 posts
Jul 30, 2009
4:27 PM
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I guess some fanciers have been able to tweek these birds better than others.Glen.
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fhtfire
2018 posts
Jul 31, 2009
5:49 PM
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I used to have a copy of a study about what made roller roll..and it used to be on the internet...but after the big Hawk bust I cant find it anywhere...go figure....especially when the Fish and Game were stating that we were flying birds that had epilepsy and we were breeding a genetic defect.
Anyway...the study was done using common pigeons and rollers...the study ran out of money and ended..but this is what they ruled out...it was not epilepsy..because that is uncontrollable...and nor predictable....the birds roll when they want to roll. They checked the workings of the inner ear as well as the brain...all were that of a normal commie pigeon...what they did find was that all the nerve endings in the back of the neck and back were SUPER sensitive and there were double the amount of nerves as you standard pigeon. The theory before the money dried up was that the Roller pigeon had these super sensitive nerves...and that the bird may feel a rush from the roll because of the rush of nerve impulses...kind of like a coon dog getting the scent of a coon....they go freaking crazy...they like the smell there nerves in the nose go into overdrive...
they did state that the roller seems to like to roll and that it is controlled......but the RO gene was found and that RO gene may be the gene that produces the nerve endings....but basically that what was found...it was NOT epilepsy, its not a balance issue, it not something the birds cant control...although there some that cant....well...there are some humans that cant run a 10 second 100 yard dash and some that can.......I will do some more digging....but the report stated that it has something to do with the extra nerves
rock and ROLL
Paul
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nicksiders
GOLD MEMBER
3588 posts
Jul 31, 2009
6:40 PM
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This is what I have came to believe: They roll due to a genetic trait that is resessive genetically. That is why not all rollers roll. It is a trait you are required to beed for. Even the bird that rolls will cease to roll if same bird goes ferrell or is with a breed that does not roll. They will also stop rolling when being persued.
The birds can be stimulated to roll in various ways either it be stress or a lack of stress.
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Just My Take On Things
Nick Siders
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RodSD
313 posts
Aug 02, 2009
12:44 AM
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I think Paul did his homework. I'll give A+ for that!
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Square
755 posts
Aug 02, 2009
11:46 AM
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I think it's all in the genes.. I agree with yellowking in the fact that it's hard to compare them to people besides the fact that they usally pair up 4life, like people, and are known to mess around like people, and some even have two or three mates like people kinda like in "Utah"LOL no disrecpect...In my eyes thats the only comparison to people there is.. Unless you were comparing them to people that had a cirtain genitic deal like terrets, O.C.D or being Bypolar.. if there were a place that breed people with thease conditions for decades then....you get my point.. it's in their genes to roll we just kept breeding them and creating diffrent variations..like a fainting Goat.or a working dog's Retrivers herding type and what not.. it's just in their Genes....it has to be there first...Hommers dont roll
Square
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"Home of the Ghost Town Roller"
K.C.R.C
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