rollinfever
121 posts
Aug 27, 2009
5:47 PM
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who is he?i would like to know whats behind his birds..where hes from and how many of you guys have this line of birds.. thanks
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T-town-rollers
89 posts
Aug 27, 2009
9:25 PM
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I looked on the net and found pics. and a write up about him. His name is Richard Jaconette. I have been looking on my p. c. trying to find that site but haven't found it yet. Theres a man who lives here in my town who knew him personaly. It was Rick Stanly's Father who had a whole lot of jacs. He is dead now but Rick still has the blood line. I have several of them too. In fact jacs. are probley the most poplar rollers in this area. Jon Layman had about 100 of the jacs. and I got 52 birds from him. He was big in portable roller lofts. I've been breeding from them for about 10 yrs. now.
Lee- T-town-rollers
hwisi2@aol.com ~ is my e-mail address.
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smeyer02
24 posts
Aug 28, 2009
11:31 AM
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All of my rollers are Jaconettes that were out of Danny Horners Lofts I am having good luck with these birds and Danny lives but a few mies form me and has been a great help with getting me on track with his fameliy of birds. I would try and reach him if you can get him to open up and talk you can get a great deal of info from him he know ever so much.
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rollinfever
122 posts
Aug 28, 2009
10:33 PM
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thanks guys..so can we say that all jaconettes are from the black rain?
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Sunflower
GOLD MEMBER
510 posts
Aug 29, 2009
4:46 AM
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No, they were not all from Black Rain. That would be like saying all Pensoms were from 514.
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Keep em Spinning
Joe
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rollinfever
123 posts
Aug 29, 2009
2:40 PM
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ok sunflower, thanks..do you guys have pics of jaconettes
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Bill C
437 posts
Aug 29, 2009
8:38 PM
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rollinfever, I had printed an old article on Richard Jaconette in our bulletin this year. If you send me your mailing address, I could send you a copy of the article. It might be out there on the web?
There is the old Jacs that were sold before Jaconette started mass producing his birds then they got the new jacs which are after he was mass producing them.
As I understand he sold so many birds that the IRS came after him and he fled to Mexico for a while?
Jaconettes are probably the most wide spread family in the USA. In Sacto Calif area 7 years ago 5 out of 6 guys had the Jacs. Today there are not as many and have become the 1 Jac family for every 5 other families.
They are prone to be unstable for their early developent basically but several guys have done well with them by selective breeding and selecting the best in the air to breed from.
I have a few of them as trigger birds in my A team to keep the others active because they are frequent but they ( the ones I have ) do not usually last more than two year before falling apart. I do have two in the A team now that are on their 3rd year flying but I should have a kit of 20 of them for the amount I raised over the past three years.
I have several families and fly them together but I have my favorites and the Jacs are filler birds for me. They are not culls or I would get rid of them. I dont like early developing birds though. So I am biased with comparison based on what I like and want. They come in every possible color in the Birmingham roller. I have grizzle and black,re-red, blue check, badge and red checks. I have had the best luck with grizzles that are not too white and blue checks also.
Email me if you would like the letter (its an old one) cridercrader@aol.com Bill C
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Velo99
2150 posts
Aug 30, 2009
6:28 AM
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Jacs are like Smiths in the phone book. There are a ton of them everywhere. It would depend on who you got them from as to how "Jaccy" they are.
Mine are off Bobby Bradleys who got his from Ellis McDonald who got his from...
In my opinion once they leave the name brand breeders hands thay arent really his birds anymore. Different eyes in the sky, different methods and atmospheric conditions tend to change the way the birds are bred and perform. They may be kept "pure" but its not the breeder pairing and managing them so...they will be different. Then you give a few of your birds away and they are once again transformed into another fanciers idea of what they should be.
514 has been dead for 20 years and people still claim 514 blood...
yits
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V99
blue sky single beat
in cadance performing now
earth beckons the winged
drawn breath is let quickly forth
orchestral movement follows
___ ~_____ __
\__\_/-|_| \__\____
/()_)__14___()_)\__\
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RUDY..ZUPPPPP
GOLD MEMBER
2781 posts
Aug 30, 2009
6:31 AM
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good morning v99..............---------
RUDY PAYEN
PANCHO VILLA LOFT
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
3648 posts
Aug 30, 2009
6:55 AM
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Kenny, in the beginning, I used to NOT reference the background of my birds because I was the one flying and breeding them, never saw Pensom or 514 in my backyard...but, often for those paying money, they want to know what's in the background before cutting loose with dollars.
On another note, I feel it is human nature to WANT TO KNOW such things. The longer I am in this thing, the more I think we ought to honor those who went before us and carried on the breed we have with us today. JMO
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FLY ON!
Tony Chavarria
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Velo99
2151 posts
Aug 30, 2009
7:15 AM
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Dang it I just misfired and dumped about 5 parargaphs of inciteful rhetoric.
Ok quick paraphrase.
I agree with you Tony on wanting to know. I also think it is a way for a guy to buy bragging rights.
Let me recall an old adage I heard on this site for the very first time. Color dont roll and peds dont fly.
If they have it in the air and in the breeder pen its just as good a bird as 514 or any one of the high dollar birds from the high toned lofts.
"Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer chances."
On fly day when the yard is full of your peers its about how well youu have managed the birds you have.
Thats another post entirely.
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V99
blue sky single beat
in cadance performing now
earth beckons the winged
drawn breath is let quickly forth
orchestral movement follows
___ ~_____ __
\__\_/-|_| \__\____
/()_)__14___()_)\__\
Last Edited by on Aug 30, 2009 7:17 AM
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rollinfever
124 posts
Aug 30, 2009
7:31 AM
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sorry i dont want to be the pain in the butt but 514 is another line? is it closely related to jaconettes?
Bill C, What do u mean they fall apart?
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Velo99
2154 posts
Aug 30, 2009
7:37 AM
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Rollin,
Its was a Pensom bird. I dont know the whole story but I am sure someone does,aint that right LaRon?
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V99
blue sky single beat
in cadance performing now
earth beckons the winged
drawn breath is let quickly forth
orchestral movement follows
___ ~_____ __
\__\_/-|_| \__\____
/()_)__14___()_)\__\
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3757
1289 posts
Aug 30, 2009
8:25 AM
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Velo - Yes, it was one of Bill Pensom's foundation hens for only one of the many lines he had of his Black Country rollers known in America as Pensoms.
Rollin - As far as the question is it closely related to Richard Jaconette I would need clarification on your definition of closely. I know that 514 is most likely behind some of his original stock but I doubt if it close at all. The last of the bulk of close 514 birds were bred and owned by Herb Sparkes or the people he was generous enough to loan his birds to.
Bill- I like your syle!
Last Edited by on Aug 30, 2009 8:26 AM
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Bill C
439 posts
Aug 30, 2009
3:15 PM
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Hi 3757, thanks for the complement, I have learned from your statements, perhaps that has something to do with it. Especially in regards to family, bloodline or inbred and purebred ect.
rollinfever, What I mean by falling apart is you spend many hours breeding, feeding, flying and training your birds to go into your A team hopefully. Not all of them but as many as you can produce each year resonably. for me that is 60 to 80 birds a year.
Now I select the best to go into the A team. But after a my Jaconnettes get to be about 2 years old I have had several that roll down all the sudden or they start leaving the kit and just dont have the stanima to keep up with the others over time. I have had several that flew great as a team player and then suddenly rolled down from 300 or 500 feet all the way down to the ground. (your tipical rolldown) But usually roll downs will happen in the first 3 to 6 months when your birds rolls 15 feet one day and then 45 feet the next day, then you know your in for likely rolldown.
I have about 5 families that I fly and the Jacs are the only ones that do this. I get a roll down now in then from other families but early in life, never in 2years,3 years or 4years of flying them. I do actaully have 3 and 4 year old kit birds in my A team. I pull the best out and keep the rest as a team. Off couse a bird will roll down or bump if it is too thin and not getting fed enough. but that has not been the problem as I am flying them out. I do think any early developing family is going to have its faults with later flying or breeding, its just a matter of time for the guy to begin to notice it.
Unlike most who say stick with one family, NOPE not me. My local competitors have practically all said I have too many birds. But I like to experiment and compare families over the long hall and that is why I have my favorites.
The jacs are an easy bird to handle compared to other bloodlines and families. Some like that as they hope to have less overflies and more frequency ect. Bill C
Last Edited by on Aug 30, 2009 3:19 PM
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DeepSpinLofts
1561 posts
Aug 30, 2009
3:40 PM
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I had some birds shipped to me in the early 80's from Richard Jaconette.
There was something about a Mr. Perkins in my phone conversations with him and he sent me pedigrees with the birds.
Now I don't know if the birds I acquired from Mr. Jaconette was the old Jac's or his new stuff.... but from they way they spinned in the air... I'm almost certain it was the old stock.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
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Sunflower
GOLD MEMBER
516 posts
Aug 30, 2009
5:07 PM
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Marcus,
If it was in the 80s, it was the new stock.
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Keep em Spinning
Joe
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J_Star
2127 posts
Aug 31, 2009
5:37 AM
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Bill, it is not the Jaccs line that is not stable. The Jaccs you have are not handling your feeding regimen. Looks like they need different attentions than your other line. The Jaccs normally smaller birds than the other lines. I have Jaccs and I don't have that problem at all. People say they sky out, which I had that problem in the past, but it turn out to be my handling problem with the birds. I’ve been around through many lofts in the States, and most people have skying out problems and that is due to the feed. Not too much feed, rather, what is being given in the feed.
Jay
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JDA
GOLD MEMBER
453 posts
Aug 31, 2009
8:10 AM
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Jay... That is why This purina nutria blend green is working so well as for the kit feeding program.The only time they sky out now is when the coopers are around.JDA
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George R.
49 posts
Aug 31, 2009
1:05 PM
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Bill
Did you get your Birds right from Jaconette ?
I have been Flying Birds that I got from Danny Horner that are bred from the Birds he got from Jaconette back in in 1979 and I have some in my kit that are 3 years old ,in 2006 I lost a kit in California due to a Pred attack that caused a overfly and there were birds in that kit that were also 3 years old that I got right from Danny Horner. I have never had a problem with them rolling down after they are mature Pigeons.
The Jaccs I got from Danny dont fly high and they come into the spin early 4 to 6 months with a few that start at 3 months , I have bred Birds for a season and put them back in the air with no problems, any way Bill I bred a few to many this year and I am willing to give you a few Birds bred out of Danny's Jacc line for you to try out.
George
Last Edited by on Aug 31, 2009 3:10 PM
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quickspin
1066 posts
Aug 31, 2009
11:55 PM
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Hi Bill can you email me
thanks
quickspin@hotmail.com
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Ball Bearing Roller Loft
I.C.R.C
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J_Star
2133 posts
Sep 01, 2009
5:24 AM
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Bill, with all due respect, is what I see in is hobby is people follow “Monkey see and Monkey do” mentality. People say all the times that the Jaccs are easy birds to work with but yet they complain that they can’t be managed...what gives!! Bill, reread your posts again…you fell in the trap of trashing the Jacs as a whole instead of the ones you owned from god know who bred them.
However, one thing about DH Jacs is they get better as they mature and I give his line credit for that.
I would like to hear Brian McCormick input about the Jacs he flies in California.
Jay
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George R.
50 posts
Sep 01, 2009
2:16 PM
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Bill
I was talking to Danny H. about what you had posted about the Jaccs falling apart after 2 or 3 years and he told me that back 1989 he had a bunch of Birds that had stopped laying or filling eggs and he put them all in a kit box and started flying the Birds. He said that a fellow named Bruce Burnett from Florida came by his house and seen the kit and said ' thats the best bunch of Rollers I have ever seen' well Bruce was so impressed that he bought the whole kit even though Danny told him that the Birds did not fill eggs or lay eggs any more.
Those pigeons were all about 10 years old and had been bred and banded by Richard Jaconette.
anyway Bill I hope you are having a good season Flying and Breeding your Birds and good luck to you in this years Fall Fly.
Bill do you know Paul Perez from Berkely Calif. ?
YITS George
Last Edited by on Sep 01, 2009 2:24 PM
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PR_rollers
GOLD MEMBER
3347 posts
Sep 01, 2009
3:04 PM
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I'm working with 14 Jacs I received from Dan G these he bought from Charlie Burnett all bred from Bill Roy 2005 to 2006 Dan never flown them he said but Burnett did . I train these birds and they flying and kitting well with my team I notice they are easy to handle and
are calm when holding in hand..I like them but yet to see how they will perform in the long run..they starting to roll 5 ft since flying for only a week. I am having fun..that's what it's all about.. .----------
Ralph.
Life comes down to the choices you make, and then living with the results.
Last Edited by on Sep 01, 2009 6:15 PM
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RUDY..ZUPPPPP
GOLD MEMBER
2784 posts
Sep 01, 2009
6:07 PM
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I fly bill roy birds and likem.....
We talk bi-weekly he said depends on where and when u got jacs from they will do the job ?
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RUDY PAYEN
PANCHO VILLA LOFT
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Bill C
441 posts
Sep 01, 2009
9:29 PM
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Thanks George and good luck to you also. I do not know Paul Perez. Although I know many guy in the bay area love the Jaconettes. Remember I do have some and have had them for 8 or 9 years now. They are just not my favorite family in the brimingham roller breed.
J star, I do know monkey see monkey do with a new guy having rollers one or two years, I would much rather quote Pensom who said it first that you should not breed deep rollers together that came into the roll the first year. He said there is an exception to everything though. As to breeding rollers and developing them, I do think Pensom is still the best there is and in his books and writtings it shows and reveals alot of truth even for today. I know he has been gone for 50+ years now but has yet to have an equal.
As for Brian McCormick, well he was here just a last year. He said, " If you want to see what a real birmingham roller looks like, go see Brent Timius birds fly!" I quoted him in our monthly bulletin if you still recieve it Jay? Brent flys his own birds that he has had for 10 years from Joe Borges! He judged my kit and I came in second to Brent, Which in of of itself is impressive that they both were Broges birds in the top two kits, but I did not get the highest quality and depth multipliers, I still came in second and was glad to place second to Brent. I dont need to toot my own horn here, just letting you know what BMC had to say about the birds in our area on that paticular fly day. It could all be different soon. LOL nothing like putting my foot in my mouth huh! Wish me luck like George because now I will need it. Bill C
Last Edited by on Sep 01, 2009 9:33 PM
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J_Star
2134 posts
Sep 02, 2009
4:55 AM
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The best of luck always to you Bill. You are a good man.
Jay
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Pumpkin Man
153 posts
Sep 03, 2009
6:13 PM
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I enjoy reading these kind of threads. Adds to the whole mystique of the hobby. The quest for the best continues....
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