George R.
108 posts
Oct 26, 2009
2:34 PM
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Do your young Birds tail ride or do quick flips when they are just starting to Fly and turnover ?
The reason I ask is I was overlooking some old records and when I flew the old school Red headed hen blood , I noticed that most of those Birds started tail riding or tumbling before they spun.
then I looked at the records of the Jaccs and I noticed that most of those Birds do quik Flips no Tailriding .
I also noticed that Birds that tail rode never turned out to be as good as Birds that did quick flips.
Maybe I can save some time and just cull out the tail riders and just train the ones that do Quick Flips.
What do you think ?????????
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George Ruiz
Last Edited by on Oct 26, 2009 2:37 PM
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XRollers
64 posts
Oct 26, 2009
2:38 PM
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my young birds tail ride when they start out flying and as I fly them more they improve and come into the roll.
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Oldfart
GOLD MEMBER
1491 posts
Oct 26, 2009
3:15 PM
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George, I think you keep some decent records! I also think it's not that easy. I judge each bird on it's own merit. I have heard that some breeders cull in the nest. What would be the point in that?
Thom
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George R.
109 posts
Oct 26, 2009
3:20 PM
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Thom
I found it very intresting that the good Birds in my Family of Birds never tail rode, they just did quick flips.
No need to spend time training tail riders if they are never gonna turn out to be deep spinners.
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George Ruiz
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Oldfart
GOLD MEMBER
1492 posts
Oct 26, 2009
3:37 PM
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George, It's too late for this year but I'll keep better records next. I'm stubborn but I can still learn. What I question, is if it pertains to your family but not to rollers as a whole.
Thom
Last Edited by on Oct 26, 2009 3:41 PM
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155
1150 posts
Oct 26, 2009
4:06 PM
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sup george
last year i had a family of birds that i was breeding out of, the birds will come in to roll and also will tail ride, i used to hate that but there all gone now!! this year i don't have any birds doing that, just fast FLIPS
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JOSE JIMENEZ AKA EVILLOFT'S
-MESA,ARIZONA-
Last Edited by on Oct 26, 2009 6:45 PM
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George R.
110 posts
Oct 26, 2009
4:07 PM
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I agree Thom , in no way do I think all rollers have the same traits.
What I was looking for was to see if other fanciers had noticed any thing like I did .
thanks Thom
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George Ruiz
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wannaroll
79 posts
Oct 26, 2009
4:49 PM
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From what I've seen most young birds start out doing tail sets, then they either start doing quick flips or just start rolling in short bursts. The good rollers you want to keep in your kits will start rolling eventually, some sooner, some later depending on the strain. From what I've heard some strains take up to six months to come into the roll. Mine seem to come in early so far. That's good cause I don't have any patience.
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Dave - Hesperia, CA.
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rollinfever
140 posts
Oct 26, 2009
6:45 PM
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Good observation George. i have a jaconette hen and she does quicks flips like that too.i havent flown her too much maybe shell improve if i do. but because i dont have a kit. but i see what your talking about. Now i have something to look foawrd to.
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jnyce
826 posts
Oct 26, 2009
7:34 PM
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i have a bird that didnt start spinng until 5 mths as a matter a fact it wasn't doing anything i was getting ready to get rid of it and one day it rpped a 10 footer super fast and tight
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jerry t
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spanky
874 posts
Oct 26, 2009
8:08 PM
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THE FAMILY OF BIRDS THAT I FLY THEY START BY DOING QUICK FLIPS. AND QUICK SPINS. THEY DONT TAIL RIDE.
SPANKY
SGVS
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Hector Coya
572 posts
Oct 26, 2009
9:06 PM
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I think it was in1986,Joe angulo finished his own life for unknown reasons,i went to the Auction they had to sell all his birds,i purchased a few Original Jaconett birds,i don't remember if the young started flipping or tail ridding but after two years of breeding that family,all i remember is that they didn't do what my Redheaded hen stuff was doing,so you never know,birds act different in different lofts..
Hector Coya
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diamondrollers
361 posts
Oct 26, 2009
9:34 PM
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i think it just prefrence on what a guy wants. I hate birds that tail ride not a trait i care to see or have. My birds do quick flips. i get a good persentage of birds buy two months flying snap fast five footers. this year they averaged 4 out of 12 would do them fast snappy 5 footers. i only bred out of 12 pair and 2 of those were pumpers i banded 75 for my self and 12 for a friend
sal
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fhtfire
2143 posts
Oct 26, 2009
10:52 PM
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I can only speak for my birds..but I have young birds do both...tail ride and quick flips...I even have some birds skip the quick flips and tail rides and start putting actual roll together and then continue to get better....I have found that damn near every bird in my stock loft that I have picked...have been the birds that dont do either..they just one day decide to jerk the chain...
rock and ROLL
Paul
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PAUL R.
112 posts
Oct 27, 2009
8:42 PM
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I,ve notice that the birds that flip over quickly tend to be faster spinners. So, I look for the ones that begin to show a faster,clean flip and this to me helps the rollers stay focused to stay as close to the kit. Flip, flip and back to the kit. Tail riders , when done riding are searching to see where the kit has flown to, then try to fly towards it. So for me, im all about the flippers.
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wishiwon2
218 posts
Oct 27, 2009
11:37 PM
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I was curious a few years back if depth of tailriding correlated to depth of spin as birds matured. What I learned is in my birds there was no correlative relationship.
I found that very few of those that showed tailriding during development ever became top spinners at my house. Those that persisted in tailriding for more than a few days, seldom developed into rollers at all.
My experience has been more like Paul's, my best go from straight fliers to good spinners in short order (maybe a week or 2). I have also had good results from those that begin with quick flips and over time hook together series of quick bursts until they show a full on roll. The longer the chain of flips or bursts they began with did relate to their mature depth. If they keep it together, they usually end up being pretty good. Im not suggesting it applies to everyone elses rollers, just what I have recorded at my loft.
One thing I have found to be nearly absolute is those birds that develope with a wingswitch or a 'grab at the air' style of roll, never grow out of that and become clean straight spinners. I believe they never learn to trust themselves and go to work, instead they're always trying to resist or stop the rolling impulse, fighting against it instead of learning to control it and go with it. I have yet to keep one for any length of time that corrected itself from being a wingswitcher and become an ace in the air. It has become a cull indicator for me.
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Jon
If it were easy, everybody would do it
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winwardrollers
320 posts
Oct 28, 2009
8:19 AM
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Jon
I would have to agree that the birds ..what you call wingswitch or grab at the air..seem to never trust themselves to release a good spin. Some of these birds could be over feed or have only been in the air for a week or two. I don't have much patient with such birds.
The good birds I have found do it right from the start and only get better.
Brad
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winwardrollers
321 posts
Oct 28, 2009
8:19 AM
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Jon
I would have to agree that the birds ..what you call wingswitch or grab at the air..seem to never trust themselves to release a good spin. Some of these birds could be over feed or have only been in the air for a week or two. I don't have much patient with such birds.
The good birds I have found do it right from the start and only get better.
Brad
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