W@yne
213 posts
Jan 26, 2007
10:47 PM
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Guys i stand corrected about saying i don't know anyone that flys crested birds in the uk. If you check out the website www.nbra.co.uk Then click on auction you will see an English flyer called Gordon Daffurn he has a birds in the that looks to be crested. I dont know the back ground of Gordon's birds but i know hes not a color breeder Like i said before i have seen tufted rollers at a guys before but i have never visited Gordon's set up and this bird looks crested. Would love to see a better photo of that bird. Also check out the prices on the auction double the pound and you got your us dollars approx. I will try and find out Gordon's background on his birds maybe Starfire would love to speak with him Lol.
regards
W@yne uk
Last Edited by on Jan 26, 2007 10:55 PM
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Ally Mac
149 posts
Jan 27, 2007
3:11 AM
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Wayne.
Did you see the price of Daves pair, I was tempted but they are well out my range now.
I am sure there is a crested bird in Winners with spinners, cant check as I have lent the book out
Al.
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W@yne
216 posts
Jan 27, 2007
3:55 AM
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Ally the thing is Dave would give you his coat off his back he never charges for his birds and also you don't need um my friend. You probably got all his blood already.
regards
W@yne uk
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Spud
66 posts
Jan 27, 2007
5:12 AM
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Graham Dexter does show a crested roller in his book "Winners with Spinners" in the photo section just past page #116. To quote him "probably the best cock I've seen roll in many years...could you see crest while it's rolling?" The birds band # was NEFRS-XX-87-35 It's a dark ck. bald crested cock. Nice looking bird
Spud
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W@yne
217 posts
Jan 27, 2007
8:46 AM
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Scotty
You are probably right there i think we over here are misquoting the word peaks with crests like i call peaks tufted i have studied the picture and thinking about it is probably is a peak dammit I've not seen Stan around much lately and i sure miss him Lol thought i could get him participating in this subject.
thanks for correcting me Scotty
regards
W@yne uk
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
1098 posts
Jan 27, 2007
9:10 AM
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Wayne, the bird in the auction you pointed out has a Crest, not a Peak. A peak is what is seen on a the back of a Mookie or Archangel. If that fellow in that auction has won or nearly won as many flys as the copy suggests, apparently his crests can roll pretty good.
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STARFIRE
307 posts
Jan 27, 2007
9:36 AM
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-Hey Guys:
Heres a better looking crest than that English one.This one spins about 30ft.I call it my redneck crest.LOL And Scotts full of crap again when he says that you cant see a shell crest on these birds.I have lots of them.LOL Bear in mind that I have been breeding these crests for 27 yrs Pure Pensom.LOL
STARFIRE
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2007 9:43 AM
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MILO
134 posts
Jan 27, 2007
10:12 AM
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Stan.
Here you go again. If you hava a problem with Scott you need to take it up with him personally and privately. He is a friend of mine, and frankly, you are out of line when you say he is full of crap. You need to be more respectful of others. You have no class. So everytime he says something you are going to pounce on him? When these color guys and him go at it...they clearly show their points when they argue and never take it to a personal level. They fight like cats and dogs, but argue their points intelligently. I am tired of reading your comments. Go ahead and attack me personally now...because I expect it. You are bottom of the barrel anyway.
c
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Missouri-Flyer
122 posts
Jan 27, 2007
10:19 AM
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to crest or not to crest.... thats the question!LOL..Jerry
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Eat, sleep, Cowboys, Pigeons... The facts of life
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2007 10:23 AM
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motherlodelofts
1324 posts
Jan 27, 2007
10:20 AM
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Wayne , do you know that guy ? that bird doesn't look right.
Stan, the cat is already out of the bag on you and your crossing, don't waste your breath.
Scott
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2007 2:26 PM
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nicksiders
1282 posts
Jan 27, 2007
1:09 PM
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A mutated Birmingham Roller with a crest is a lot different than a cross bred crest. Stan, the cat IS out and your bag is empty. Just enjoy your birds as they are without the deceit. I think you are a nice guy, but you're trying to sell us something that ain't what you say it is.
I enjoy having your input, but please give up the BS about your crests.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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STARFIRE
308 posts
Jan 27, 2007
3:04 PM
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-Hey Nick:
When you certain guys give up the B.S that my crests are crossed I'll stop defending them.You guys have never seen any of my birds ,you don't know anything about them and yet your an expert on the crested bird issues.If you guys keep it up I'll respond every time.Have any of you guys ever seen a crested roller anywhere out there?Hector Coya has some he says arn't crossed.Is he lieing too?There has been alot of responses about crested rollers popping up over a long period of time.You guys just refuse to believe that this could happen ,because it didn't happen in your family of birds.You all go out of your way to denegrate my crested birds for what ,I don't know.They are what they are.Pure Penson birmingham rollers.Like it or not.Any body that says my birds are crossed is full of crap .period.and that includes you nick.
STARFIRE
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motherlodelofts
1328 posts
Jan 27, 2007
3:20 PM
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MILO
137 posts
Jan 27, 2007
3:40 PM
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Well lets let it all hang out then. If you say your birds are pure Pensom Birmingham Rollers, then it is you who are full of crap. And if by some small miracle you could prove it. It wouldn't matter. They look like shit. So, having said that...would someone close to Stan give him a visit. I need to hear from someone other than him they can do anything but tumble. I would go myself, but I don't visit that country.
c
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MILO
138 posts
Jan 27, 2007
3:41 PM
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By the way Stan. I don't know what it is...I just like being mean to you. I can't explain it...LOL
c
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Hector Coya
106 posts
Jan 27, 2007
5:17 PM
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I dont know what the big deal of crest .
the last crest i got was in October,i donated 2 young crest for the raffle at a show,a guy walked up to me and told me his birds had produced a crest,he didnt want to breed from it so he gave it to me,let me tell you its a real nice looking hen,he has Jaconett bird's he didnt cross them with anything,he was surpriced to see mine becouse he thought it only happened to him.
I got another crest from a well known flyer that has won the Fall fly and is verry highly respected,he gave me a crest that came out of his loft but ascked me not to tell anyone where i got it.
I personally like the crest , i pay the feed bill so thats that.
I think it's childish to keep putting stan down if you never saw his birds in the air,mine roll real good and im sure his do too.
Hector C
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motherlodelofts
1333 posts
Jan 27, 2007
5:24 PM
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Hector, it's funny how those crests only pop up in the funniest of places and only in lofts where they don't mind strange blood.
As for Stan, there is more to his crests than he's telling , he knows it, I know it , and so do at least a couple others that "have" been there.
Scott
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2007 5:25 PM
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nicksiders
1286 posts
Jan 27, 2007
6:13 PM
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It is not crests that I have a problem with; they do happen. And, it is not even what some people have do to create them. What it is about, is not telling the truth that they created them through cross breeding another breed into the BR. If that was said by the breeder I would just go on about my business not saying a damn thing.
Do you ever wonder why these "respected" flyers didn't want you to tell where they came from? I would have done something more than just say "okay". I would like to think that once that was asked of me I would not have taken the bird(s). A red flag would have burst through the ground so loadly that it would have crumpled his respectability right before my eyes. I wouldn't care if it was Monty himself.
I have had color breeders insist that they were performance breeders "ONLY". If they were to simply say "yes, I dabble with a bit of color. But, my first love is performance" I would have said nothing and moved on in my little dumb-ass world and said nothing. But, to have someone grin in your face and lie about something so unimportant........no, no, no. I have to say something becuase they are insulting me.
Hector, nobody is saying anything about you having crests. You have always been up front about it, so there is nothing for us to say.
Only if ol' Bill Clinton had been up front about poor little Monica the conservatives would have to just move on. But, he lied and the conservatives just had to go after him didn't they(LOL). He insulted them.
This was a real long reply to a small problem wasn't it? That is what happens when you have no life.
Sorry.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2007 6:14 PM
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STARFIRE
309 posts
Jan 27, 2007
7:19 PM
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-Hey Scott and Nick.
Your' still both full of crap.You know it and I know it.Nothing but lies.
STARFIRE
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nicksiders
1288 posts
Jan 27, 2007
8:43 PM
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I know, Stan.............
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Snicker Rollers
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2007 5:03 AM
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motherlodelofts
1335 posts
Jan 28, 2007
3:12 AM
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Oakie - Dokey Stan , personaly my favorite was the one with the hood and crest , two different mutations on that one , oh you lucky dog.
Scott
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2007 3:34 AM
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C.J.
904 posts
Jan 28, 2007
6:49 AM
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here we go again lol
C.J.
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STARFIRE
310 posts
Jan 28, 2007
9:28 AM
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Hey Guys:
Don't be jealous that you don't have any crested birds like mine.If you had a pure family of pensons like mine for 40 yrs ,you might be able to breed some.LOL I should send some over to California .You could breed them with those barn pigeons you own and get them a lot more depth and tightness.LOL You could call them Crowned Birmingham barn pigeons.You would be proud then.
STARFIRE
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Frankie
36 posts
Jan 28, 2007
10:25 AM
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Stan, it's not worth arguing over. I found that out yesterday the hard way. I wasted all day defending
what I know and love deeply it changed nobodies mind.
I'm new to this chat room and to rollers but I could
see that their were a few people on here that have
nothing better to do then try to belittle people
and what they believe and what they know for a
fact (from first hand experience). Personally,
I don't know if there's crested rollers but if you
like them and they perform for you then enjoy them,
instead of arguing on here with people. It's like
Hector said and I think Jimbo said the other day,
"You pay for the feed so have fun with it!" So
that's what I'm going to do. Personally, I think
crested rollers would be neat to have I wouldn't
mind having a pair or two myself. Yesterday was
my first and my last day that I will spend on
here arguing, debating, and defending what I know
and love because I have better things to do that
are a lot more relaxing and fun. Regards, Frankie
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motherlodelofts
1338 posts
Jan 28, 2007
10:40 AM
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Relax Frankie , it's all good , we all get another perspective and something to ponder about from these debates ,I rarely see it as arguing and much is learned through them.
Scott
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2007 10:41 AM
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W@yne
223 posts
Jan 28, 2007
10:43 AM
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Frankie
My friend i didn't express my opinions to offend you by any means at all its a free world and anyone has the right to express their opinions. If everybody took it to heart no one would be on this site look at Stan for instance he takes fire from all directions and he keeps coming back with both barrels loaded he sure is a fighter Lol. I myself have been given stick on this site for expressing my opinion ok sometimes it pisses you off but at the end of the day there are only pigeons and dogs we are talking about by no means have i or Scotty or anyone else on this site have tried to belittle you whatsoever hope you understand where i am coming from and if we have offended you in anyway i appolagise so come on Frankie just grin and bear it man all is forgotten don't take it to heart we enjoy new members on this site that's what makes it all worthwhile .
regards
W@yne uk
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Missouri-Flyer
137 posts
Jan 28, 2007
10:44 AM
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Hey Frankie,
This " PURE B/R Crested Roller" debate has been going on a long time between these 3. I for 1 enjoy watching them, and I think they get just a big of a kick out of it. They are like 3 siblings that were born 11 and a 1/2 months apart and shared the same bedroom... Always something just to get under the others skin, but in kindness.
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Eat, sleep, Cowboys, Pigeons... The facts of life
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nicksiders
1295 posts
Jan 28, 2007
11:59 AM
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Damn Frankie relax man. Stan and I are just two old men flapping our paper rectums. He or I are not mean people....a little head strong maybe. He just has to own up to crossing a crested tumbler into the Birmingham Roller and everything will settle down(LOL) Don't take youself so serious; I know I am just a blowhard clown.
I enjoy the bantering back and forth. I learn a lot from it. Other people's ideas and beliefs are important to me. Stick around and enjoy. Just be ready to recieve and accept a different opinion.
We all love our critters in here.
I only believe half of what I say; do; and think(LOL).
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2007 12:05 PM
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Frankie
38 posts
Jan 28, 2007
12:21 PM
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W@yne, your right I said it earlier everyone has an opinion and most of them are different. But when you start talking about doing away with a breed. Like pits, I have to stand up for them because their just a dog they can't do it for themselves and I lived it and heard it for 20 years and I will defend them till the day I die and I'll say it again it's not the dogs fault it's the peoples fault. I've read so many post that I don't even remember if you liked them or didn't like them, without going back and looking and I'm sure the hell not going to do that.~lol~
Jerry, thanks for telling me this about the 3 or 4 of them bickering and arguing all the time. But even siblings get their feelings hurt. If Stan loves his crested rollers as much as I love my dogs then I don't think he enjoys people running them down and calling them crap. Maybe he does.... Do you Stan? If so I'm sorry for interrupting and if all of this is how you get your kicks and done in fun then I don't see how you keep new members they most be some hard headed S.O.Bs like me.~lol~ Because you ain't ran me off yet. I may have to rest a little while and feed the birds and pet the dogs but I'll be back with a vengeance.~lol~ Is anybody flying any of their birds today? I wish I could fly mine even if they don't roll. It sure is a pretty day here in North Central Arkansas. Frankie
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2007 12:30 PM
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W@yne
224 posts
Jan 28, 2007
12:53 PM
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Frankie
Look i apologised if i offended you on the dog subject as far as I'm concerned we both have our views I'm also a dog lover and i think most people in this site are also . I know where you are coming from but just let it be whats been said has been said. As far as the subject goes is end of chat for me so forget about it and enjoy the other subjects on this site, I can see your very fond of your pit bulls that is cool with me like i said before everyone has there own opinions and i respect you for that . But also respect my views also. I would like to say Frankie i was not aiming my opinions to your dogs personally.
regards
W@yne uk
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C.J.
906 posts
Jan 28, 2007
1:23 PM
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Frankie If you are going to last then you need to just let somethings go. Stan and I have gone head to head in the past but its all good. Opinions are like butt holes we all have one unfortuneately some of us have a lot more opinions than butt holes. lol Stan gets a laugh from it. He doesn't care what people think so why should you or anyone else. Stan and Scott go head to head everytime the crest issue comes up, but if Stan needed help Scott would be there for him. They are both stubborn, bullheaded, opinionated ummm lol hey guys let me know if I have left anything out. The thing everyone needs to learn is people will say things to another person that they wouldn't dare in public because they would be missing teeth. It is going to happen no matter where you go. I hope you decide to stick around. The debates are what makes things interesting around here. The only thing I don't agree with is when guys who have no clue about the debate start jumping in and name calling. I agree they are your birds your hobby your loft and your time and nones business, but Stan lives to rattle Scotts cage. So as long as Scott and Stan can type the debates are going to continue.
C.J.
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2007 2:04 PM
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motherlodelofts
1341 posts
Jan 28, 2007
1:40 PM
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"They are both stubborn, bullheade, opinionated ummm lol hey guys let me know if I have left anything out. "
C.J. other than adding bright and good looking, I think that you about covered it, but I'm sure that if you got my wifes input that list could get rather lengthy LOL.
Scott
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2007 1:42 PM
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C.J.
908 posts
Jan 28, 2007
2:04 PM
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LOL scott you crack me up!!
C.J.
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Jimbo113
48 posts
Jan 28, 2007
7:09 PM
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Howdy Y'all.
If I saw here something posted bt Stan that he got a laugh out of being blasted every time the subject comes up I would be suprised. Seems to me that several are all to ready to line up to get their punches in. I doubt he enjoys it as much as some would have us believe. Of course I could be wrong. If I were it would surely change the way I read some of this stuff.
I will be watching to see a post by Stan about how much fun it is............or not. ?????????
Jimbo
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"We Don't Rent Pigs"
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Frankie
41 posts
Jan 30, 2007
12:43 AM
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you and me jimbo
Frankie
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MILO
140 posts
Jan 30, 2007
8:43 AM
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Jimbo.
You bet. I'm standing in line to take another shot...LOL Stan...Say something...LOL
c
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Jimbo113
50 posts
Jan 30, 2007
11:44 AM
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Milo,
I had no doubt you would be ready to get in line. That's all I will say about that.
I still haven't seem Stan posting here how much he enjoys these little exchanges though. That's what I was looking for so as to verify statements from those standing in the line that it is all in good fun and he likes it (paraphrased).
If he does then I will look at the whole thing from a different perspective. Still waiting...
Jimbo
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"We Don't Rent Pigs"
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STARFIRE
313 posts
Jan 30, 2007
11:48 AM
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-Hi Guys:
I thought I shoud reply to the lies and B.S. these guys are about.Scott& Milo I said it before and I'll say it again You have no credibility, you mouth off about something you know nothing about.Scott makes up lies to make himself right and to make himself feel good.and Milo sounds like he's a parrot echoing Scotts B.S.I'll say it again your both full of crap.and wouldn't know the truth if someone hit you on the head with it.Thats because you don't want to know.You wouldn't be able to belittle people and make yourselves feel better than everybody else.Thats all you guys know what to do.Everbody on this site knows it.It dosen't bother me what you say because I know you don't know any better.You sound like desperate men drowning in a sea of color.And your sinking fast.LOL
STARFIRE
Last Edited by on Jan 30, 2007 11:53 AM
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Missouri-Flyer
150 posts
Jan 30, 2007
11:50 AM
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Oh No, here we go.....LOL...you get em' Stan...LMAO
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Eat, sleep, Cowboys, Pigeons... The facts of life
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Frankie
43 posts
Jan 30, 2007
12:20 PM
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Stan I am new at this but that's the way it looks to me to
and I don't thing you like having your birds talked bad
about like they say you do. Frankie
Last Edited by on Jan 30, 2007 12:25 PM
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MILO
141 posts
Jan 30, 2007
4:58 PM
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Stan.
You're so witty. LOL No, I am not Scott's parrot. I have a brain. I have my own opinions. My opinion is that your birds are so ugly that it makes me nauseous. I don't respond favorably to you because you speak like an ignorant jerk. The only time you are remotely cordial, is if someone is praising you or those horrific birds of yours. SO, that is why I dislike what you have to stand for. You dislike me (not for what I have to say) because I agree with Scott's very basic observations about your mongrelizing techiniques. The meaner and more infantile your posts become, the meaner my responses back will be. I don't attack anyone in here. For you, I will make an exception. On that note, I know you are, but what am I?
LMAO
c
Last Edited by on Jan 30, 2007 4:59 PM
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STARFIRE
315 posts
Jan 30, 2007
5:06 PM
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-Hey Milo;
That doesnt't make you less full of crap.
STARFIRE
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J_Star
782 posts
Jan 30, 2007
5:10 PM
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Stan and Milo,
Please don't make it personal. Cut down on the rhetoric and keep it down. Stan..no reason for foul mouthing anybody. If you guys continue on that path, we will stop all of you immediately. Show your sportsmanship.
Jay
Site Moderator
Last Edited by on Jan 30, 2007 5:11 PM
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STARFIRE
316 posts
Jan 30, 2007
5:46 PM
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-Hey Jay:
What do you call foulmouthing?Would it sound better if I said Liar?I have my own website and I don't have any moderators there.I can say what I want.Free country.
STARFIRE
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C.J.
910 posts
Jan 30, 2007
6:08 PM
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Jimbo I am not quite sure where you are paraphrasing from when you say people say Stan likes it. But I could be wrong please quote it. As for the stan issue and Scott. This has been going on for ever and a day. One minute they will be at each others throats the next they are civil. Both men have extremme beliefs when it comes to their birds. Stan will fight with anyone and so will Scott. As for Milo I am sorry but I feel you are out of line when you come after Stan on Scott's behalf. Scott is a big boy, he is completely capable of defending himself. There is no need for you to attack Stan or his birds. No where on here did Stan tell you that you should abandon your birds and convert to his Crested Rollers. Stan even goes as far to call them Starfire Rollers. As for his birds not rolling I am an hour and a half from Stan. I have never been there but hope to visit in the spring. However I have visted a guy who purchased birds from Stan. I assure you they are a smaller bird that looks like anyone elses bird other than the crest and yes they do roll. Stan has just decided to breed for the crest that sometimes shows up in lofts. Just because it shows up doesn't mean his birds are crap. I used to have two birds in my loft that when paired together would create this crest. No other time did it show. This crest may not be your cup of tea and thats o.k. no one is telling you to get any. As an adult you need to respect Stan's right to choose. I may not always agree with Stan but I do respect and admire his loyalty to his birds. If you haven't been to his loft or know him personally how can you say he is full of crap when he says they are Pensom. Whether they are or aren't I don't know or really care. At the end of the day they aren't my birds, my vision, my money or my time that all belongs to him. I would never insult you on your breeding program because I feel that as a man I should respect your choices. I am sure if you polled all of the fanciers on here who weren't connected you would find many different thoughts and visions on their birds.
In the end I guess what I am saying is have a little respect and remember the golden rule.
"TREAT PEOPLE HOW YOU WANT TO BE TREATED"
After all at the end of the day we all love our birds.
If this isn't good enough remember this site isn't here by luck. Tony counts on this site for his lively hood. If new fanciers are turned off it means a loss of potential income for Tony. In the end this could effect this site and OUR use of it.
Finally Milo I hope you can understand where I am coming from. We want you here but not at the expense of Tony's number one site.
C.J.
Site Moderator
Last Edited by on Jan 30, 2007 6:17 PM
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Missouri-Flyer
155 posts
Jan 30, 2007
6:15 PM
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well put C.J
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Eat, sleep, Cowboys, Pigeons... The facts of life
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C.J.
911 posts
Jan 30, 2007
6:25 PM
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Stan Tony has asked his site moderators to monitor the threads for any comments that aren't appropriate. Jay was right in cautioning you and Milo. As for your site there is a big difference. Tony depends on this site for a living. When people turn visitors off with the constant name calling it ends up costing Tony money. If you don't respect the decisions made by moderators respect Tony's judgement. Everything we remove from here is sent to Tony. He is kept up to date on everything. If he felt we ( site moderators) over step our bounds he has vito power. I am well aware that you have your own site, but there is a big difference you do not have nearly the amount of hits that Tony does here. Next yours site does not have a forum so there is no need for moderators and finally your site is as a hobby. THIS SITE IS CONNECTED TO TONY"S FAMILIES LIVELY HOOD. If you want to post something to Milo or Scott that is derogatory I suggest you do it on your site. Everyone needs to remember this site is given to us by Tony free of charge and we need to have respect for that. We aren't saying don't have heated debates. After all that is what makes the site interesting. What we are saying is show respect for one another and the differences in opinions that you see on here.
Thank You
C.J.
Site Moderator
Last Edited by on Jan 30, 2007 6:27 PM
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Frankie
44 posts
Jan 30, 2007
7:10 PM
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About time that other people see what I saw
just being on here a week or so. I signed up to
learn about rollers, talk to different people,
meet a few people, and make a few friends. I can
tell you from a new members point of view that
if you just go back a couple weeks and reread some
of these post you would see that's not
what is always happening on here. Some new members
and maybe some old ones that has been here for
awhile... might have second thoughts about posting
something on here because they're afraid of
what people might say but not me and I'm sure that
there are other people that feel the same
way I do. Just to let everybody know that I'm not
upset with anyone on here and I hope nobody is
upset with me. Hope to read and learn more about people
and birds and different stuff on here. Sincerely, Frankie
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Ballrollers
640 posts
Jan 30, 2007
7:48 PM
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Gentlemen,
While Scott takes a time out from the list to do battle with the World Cup GC because he does not like his scheduled time to fly this year...you know me...I always like to add a little factual information when the b@#%*t gets too deep. For the guys who think they might know everything about a man's rollers without ever seeing them in the loft or in the air or without ever looking at his pedigree records.....read on!
In a post to the veloroll roller list on
August 13, 2005, from Rick Schoening, a very reputable and experienced rollerman and world cup judge.... "Guys, I have brought this up before and no one really commented on it. That is the fact that crested Birmngham Rollers are getting to be pretty common in the UK and in parts of the US. What is your take on that? Is the crest a throw back to original birds used to make the Birmingham Roller or is it a new mutation? I saw peak crests and shell crests on some of the Besance family. Graham Dexter claimed that his 1979 blue bar white flight hen (Her Royal Majesty, I think he called her), is responsible for all of the crested rollers that Les Besance and others have. (She was a plain head). This 1979 bird was from Graham's Ken White line of birds. I remember Ralph Hilton being slammed for crests at his lofts as being breed crosses. He swore they were pure Birminghams. Doc Reimann had some of them from this old Hilton family. Was Ralph just a victim of the breed police? I understand the genetics on how to make test matings to see if you do have crests in your potential stock candidate. It is a simple recessive trait. I personally don't like crests and will not tolerate it if it ever pops up in my own loft. My birds have a lot of the Shackleton blood still running through them. When I was last in the UK I asked John Huntington about the crests. He told me he had them pop up in his Shacks. I am wondering if a guy flew a team of them and did well, would he be called a cross breeder for "Archangel crossess??????" Or does the flying fraternity accept that crests are part of the Birmingham Roller and is an acceptable characteristic? I'm not trying to start another argument, just wondering what you guys really think about these crests?"
There was only one response that I saved. From Hank Johnson: "Hello Rick, My uncle Doug Stephens, who got me started in rollers,had a tightly inbred family of Pensom rollers that was built around a black mottle hen (whose picture is in Pensom's book). I did not see any crests in his birds in 1960.....but by 1963 they were popping up! He was breeding a family from the hen and two cocks......Obviously, the crests were there then in our Birminghams. FYI, Hank Johnson"
Each of you can draw his own conclusions, but, Stan I'd say you are pretty good company, my friend!! Isn't it interesting how a little history lesson puts a different slant on the conversation?! I think that it is safe to say....once again.....that these guys who put up posts boasting to be the one-source of all information about the "pure" Birmingham Roller, and criticising another man's birds without ever seeing them in the loft, in the air or without seeing his pedigree records, and refusing to take a man's word simply because his information does not fit into their personal agendas about the "purity" of the breed, are proving themselves, over and over, to be nothing short of big bags of wind......but that's just my personal opinion!
YITS,
Cliff
Last Edited by on Jan 31, 2007 7:55 AM
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nicksiders
1304 posts
Jan 30, 2007
8:32 PM
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Cliff,
Well, First of all the business that Scott Campbell has with the WC GC is none of your business unless you are the GC or you are Scott Campbell and you are niether.
Secondly, you have not always been together with the facts. So, some of us don't know you to be the man with the facts.
Thirdly, there is a difference between crests and peeks. Peeks have always been a part of the BR. There are many who believe the crests came from other breeds. There are others who can and have collaberated Scott's belief about some crests not being what the breeder says they are.
Now I am not going to bring in people's names nor am I going to do anything to prove my second point further then what has already been said in previous post both in this forum and another forum.
No matter what your response will be to me on this thread.....this is all I am going to say.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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