George R.
1342 posts
Feb 08, 2009
8:08 PM
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Recently a friend told me that a group of Guys always fly first when there is a Fly.
He said he told them why cant the someone else fly first instead of one of them. He said thier reply was " WE HAVE BETTER BIRDS AND WE ARE THE SENIOR FLYERS".
Can you believe that BULLSH@#T !!!!!!
That would never happen in our Region.
George
Last Edited by on Feb 08, 2009 8:53 PM
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Hector Coya
414 posts
Feb 08, 2009
8:15 PM
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It all depends on the regional director,
Hector Coya-SGVS
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Scott
1681 posts
Feb 08, 2009
8:21 PM
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What region is that George.
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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George R.
1343 posts
Feb 08, 2009
8:49 PM
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its back east Scott
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PAUL R.
34 posts
Feb 08, 2009
9:57 PM
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Hector & George,
It has happen to some extent out here in the Inland Empire. You have a person that pays for 2-kits & gets early mornings on different days. Opposed to other flyers not part of there club, get to fly at 2pm instead of flying at a reasonable time frame.
But like Hector said, Its the Regional flyer or Director that can make flying enjoyable or not.
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PAUL R.
35 posts
Feb 08, 2009
9:58 PM
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George,
YES I CAN BELIEVE THE BS ! !
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Windjammer Loft
694 posts
Feb 09, 2009
7:08 AM
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Oh you "comp guys" and your funny stories.....LOL
Fly High and Roll On
Paul
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Scott
1690 posts
Feb 09, 2009
11:53 AM
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Why don't they "vote" in new RDs then ? they do vote their RDs in ,correct ?
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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DeepSpinLofts
1149 posts
Feb 09, 2009
12:10 PM
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George... I would like to see these seniors birds fly.  Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on Feb 09, 2009 12:14 PM
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Scott
1692 posts
Feb 09, 2009
12:22 PM
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I find it hard to believe that anyone would actualy say anything like this, this has to be made up.
( " WE HAVE BETTER BIRDS AND WE ARE THE SENIOR FLYERS".)
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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Andy_her
67 posts
Feb 09, 2009
12:55 PM
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I believe you...
This stuff happen all the time...
It happen to me as will...
Next time video tape it and get proof...
Just as a warming they might kick you out of the club...
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BA Rollers
178 posts
Feb 09, 2009
12:57 PM
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Paul, I'll give you a chance to explain your opinion in greater detail before I blast your first post full of holes.
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topnotch uk
243 posts
Feb 09, 2009
1:09 PM
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now then lads boys will be boys 1or2 have tr yd some thing like this but only trying to fly last at night when the dusk all ways makes the birds look 10 times faster in the roll but we put a stop to that s#it m8ty
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fhtfire
1788 posts
Feb 09, 2009
5:21 PM
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WOW!!
First off...that is soooo wrong....in 9B we usually do it by the best and quickest route...driving...and we try and do certain area together. But we usually finish everyone off in the morning hours each day...
But to be honest...is there really a bad fly time....unless you have heat...the fly time should not matter if you get the time in advance and fly your brids on that schedule....unless you have heat..the birds should not care what time of day it is if you have them on the schedule...My B-team that won our region and was flown at 2pm or so....and my A-team was a morning fly....if the birds are ready they are ready...fly time means nothing again..unless you get heat in the afternoon.
rock and ROLL
Paul
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fhtfire
1789 posts
Feb 09, 2009
5:22 PM
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Oh yes,...Myth # 129.....birds fly better in the morning....
rock and ROLL
Paul
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JohnP
4 posts
Feb 09, 2009
5:25 PM
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Scott, George,
I know of a Region that this very thing has been going on for a few years now. A group of 4 or 5 Guys ALWAYS get Their preferred Fly times. BS! It was also said that They are posting the high scores, and deserve the time of Their choice. BS! It may be a little easier to post a better score if a Person can Fly when They want, compared to when They are told to Fly. BS! They also appoint Their RD's, instead of letting the Region vote one in. BS! That is against the NBRC By-Laws. They also enter kits for Flyer's that don't even have Birds. BS! These conditions will bite Them in Their Asses.
Stay tuned, John
Last Edited by on Feb 09, 2009 5:56 PM
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Scott
1705 posts
Feb 09, 2009
5:38 PM
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A region CANNOT just appoint thier RDs by a select few if others are willing to take the job on,it MUST be put up to vote.
If this is happening submit a formal complaint to me with a list of names (at least 3) supporting it and I will submit it to the W/C commitee , if the current RD wasn't voted in by the majority of the region he has no business there representing the region.
On the NBRC side Cliff should be all over this, as he should be and not just let a few appoint thier own RD without the vote of the region, this is against the rules and allows someone on the commitee that is illegit if it indeed is happening, what region are we talking about here ?
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Just my Opinion
Scott
Last Edited by on Feb 09, 2009 5:49 PM
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JohnP
5 posts
Feb 09, 2009
5:56 PM
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Scott,
I cannot release that information or My source at this time, as change is a comin'.
Stay tuned, John
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BA Rollers
179 posts
Feb 10, 2009
10:13 AM
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"It has happen to some extent out here in the Inland Empire. You have a person that pays for 2-kits & gets early mornings on different days. Opposed to other flyers not part of there club, get to fly at 2pm instead of flying at a reasonable time frame."
Okay, you had your chance Paul. Pays for two kits and gets early mornings on two different days. You failed to mention why two different days. Here all second kits are flown generally on the last day of the fly weekend. So if a person happens to be one of the first on the schedule on one day and is one of the four or five that happen to fly a second kit, chances are his second kit is going to be in the morning sometime. You want some of that medicine? Enter and fly two kits homie.
Second.
The RD doesn't make the schedule based on who is in what club. It goes by the easiest route in combination with what days a flyer can actually be home to fly. The RD job in this region is a tough one, so tough that no one wanted to do it so the current RD just picked up and said he would bear the burden. Yah, he makes mistakes, but at least he is doing the job that no one in this region has stood up to do. You want to point fingers? How about you and others who don't like the RD deciding not to fly with your designated region but rather one to the south, because you and some other guys think they always get a raw deal. So what did you guys do? None of the guys from the region you invaded qualified for the finals, only the invading guys. Sound fair? Wanna point some fingers? How about this. Have you ever stopped and considered that one reason guys on the outskirts of the congregation of flyers will often not fly at ideal times. You were once part of a large group of guys in that area that often had half a day to that area. Since you are about one of the only ones left there now, chances are you aren't going to the first to fly. I had to fly the WC at 2pm in 100 degree temps last year Paul, in fact I was last on the list. Everyone doesn't get the time they want. I would prefer 9 am. In fact I'd rather have 10 am over 8 am any day.
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Velo99
2055 posts
Feb 10, 2009
1:23 PM
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A couple of times over the last few years, the RD was appointed on a rotational basis, kind of. There was always the disclaimer, if you dont have any objections. This was asked over a fly without everyone in attendeance but it was an informal vote.
As far as fly times the guy who keeps the judge usually flys first. In our region it is pretty much up to the group of flyers in particular parts of the region to set their own fly times. If I have to I will intervene,but so far everyone is being good and being fair.
Just be glad you get to fly.
Some guys dont get to participate because of the remote area thing. I dont like it and will make provisions for it in our region.
yits
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V99
blue sky single beat
in cadance performing now
earth beckons the winged
drawn breath is let quickly forth
orchestral movement follows
___ ~_____
\__\_/-|_| \__\____
/()_)__14___()_)\__\
Last Edited by on Feb 10, 2009 1:30 PM
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spanky
763 posts
Feb 10, 2009
10:15 PM
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TRUE THAT SOME GUYS WANT TO PICK WHAT TIME THEY FLY AND THATS BS. IS ALL READY HARD FOR THE RD AND THEY ARE MAKING IT WORST. I WAS THE RD FOR 9A AND IT WAS ALL BS. WOULD NEVER DO IT AGAIN.
SPANKY
SGVS
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PAUL R.
36 posts
Feb 11, 2009
11:15 PM
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Wow, And Wow once again To you Cliff. Im not sorry I didnt respond back to your window of opportunity but at least you were anxious enough to put your true thoughts thru.
Regards to: 1)(Here all second kits are flown generally on the last day of the fly weekend) response-- Sounds like your region flys saturday and sunday which makes sense to fly the second kit on the last day of the weekend. But here in this region, we at times end up with 4-days to fly and during these days, One would hope to get routed in the morning, at least 1 of the 4 days, but like you said ( generally ) Well, not in this region, your word has no significance.
REGARDS TO: 2) ( The RD doesn't make the schedule based on who is in what club It goes by the easiest route in combination with what days a flyer can actually be home to fly. ) RESPONSE: I"ve heard the turmoil the previous RD in this area was getting from these same individuals and include the new now RD in this conversation, These members felt that because a mans kit birds were on fire, ready to put some serious numbers, that they should go first regardless who was to be scheduled.
REGARDING : (Yah, he makes mistakes) RESPONSE- I asked why, his response was, "You saw that and I saw this". So, whether he is right or wrong his right all of the times so theres no win,win situation when a Man cant face upto being wrong.
REGARDS TO: ( I had to fly the WC at 2pm in 100 degree temps last year Paul, in fact I was last on the list. Everyone doesn't get the time they want. I would prefer 9 am. In fact I'd rather have 10 am over 8 am any day. ) Response: Once again Ciff, sounds like you have been only hearing from there side. But why kidd ourselfs, you should have access to the previous years on the scheduling back here. Oh, lets not forget that, (generally) I beginning to like you word Cliff, When a person flys 2 kits, the fly-coordinator or RD or whoever has the task, never writes the band #'s of the 2 kits being flown. Theres just so much inconsistancy that has arised from the new RD. The Previous RD MARSHAL DUNCAN made all efforts to keep things balanced. Why Should we pay an EXTRA $25.00 TO FLY A KIT . WHEN WE ARE BEING TOLD, THEY WILL GET A JUDGE FROM A DIFFERENT REGION AND TO COVER HIS EXPENSES, BUT WE END UP WITH A JUDGE FROM THERE CLUB.
LETS SEE, 20 FLYERS X 45 THATS $900.00 & $400.00 WOULD GO TO THE WC OR NBRC. BUT THE OTHER $500 ARE FOR EXPENSES FOR PAPER, PHONE CALLS, STAMPS, INTERNET USE, INK,ENVELOPES, FOOD & GAS FOR THE JUDGE ,.OH, HOLD UP, ONLY FOOD NO GAS. AT LEAST THIS IS WHAT HAS BEEN SAID. NOW THATS ON JUST 20 FLYERS. NOT COUNTING WHEN THERES BEEN MORE.
$500.00 TO SEND AN INVITATION AND A SCHEDULE & FOOD FOR THE JUDGE, THATS A BIT STEAP, CLIFF.
IM NOT TRYING TO CHALLENGE YOU CLIFF, BUT, YOU OPENED THE WINDOW.
I THOUGHT I WAS PRETTY BROAD ABOUT MY EARLIER POST:
( It has happen to some extent out here in the Inland Empire. ) CLIFF , THE KEY WORD WAS: TO SOME EXTENT.
SOME EXTENT. BUT, I GUESS IT DIDNT COMPUTE.
IF I OFFENDED YOU ( CLIFF ) OR ANYONE ,
I DO APOLOGIZE.
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gotspin7
2235 posts
Feb 12, 2009
6:22 AM
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List, I fly what ever time it does not matter, if your birds are on they are on. I agree with the firefighter on this one. Good luck guys.
Paul, that was not Cliff, that is actually a guy that flies in your region. Good luck!
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Sal Ortiz
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Ballrollers
1752 posts
Feb 12, 2009
6:41 AM
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I don't know who you are or what you are talking about, Paul. I have not commented on this thread. Perhaps you mean BA or Paul. You should pay attention to whom you are addressing your comments. Thanks for getting my back, Sal.
Cliff
Last Edited by on Feb 12, 2009 6:46 AM
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topnotch uk
265 posts
Feb 12, 2009
8:03 AM
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now then lads
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silent187
393 posts
Feb 12, 2009
11:44 AM
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SUP paul R??
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PAUL R.
37 posts
Feb 12, 2009
4:39 PM
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CLIFF BALL,.. IM SO, SO SORRY. I RECEIVED A PHONE EARLIER TODAY AND I WAS CORRECTED. I THOUGHT IT WAS YOU. BUT INSTEAD I WAS TOLD IT WAS :
( BRIAN McCORMICK ) THE ONE POSTING UNDER
( BA ROLLERS )
HOPE MY APOLIGY IS ACCEPTED
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George R.
1348 posts
Feb 12, 2009
5:42 PM
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"List, I fly what ever time it does not matter, if your birds are on they are on. I agree with the firefighter on this one. "
If the time dont matter then I wonder why the so called SENIORS with the BETTER Birds dont ever let someone else Fly in the morning and the SENIORS with BETTER BIRDS fly in the afternooon .
I always Fly my Birds at diffrent Times , this way they will be able to adjust to a Afternooon or morning Fly or even mid day Fly.
George
Last Edited by on Feb 12, 2009 5:43 PM
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George R.
1349 posts
Feb 12, 2009
5:47 PM
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Cliff is the Fly Director maybe he can do a FULL BLOWN investigation and find out what regions are are alwys letting the OLD GUARD fly first.
there should be a rule in the bylaws to prevent these things from happening.
George
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PAUL R.
38 posts
Feb 12, 2009
6:50 PM
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BRIAN MCCORMICK, SOUNDS LIKE YOU'RE HURTING A BIT TOO MUCH BEHIND THIS.
HAVE FUN FLYING.
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BA Rollers
183 posts
Feb 12, 2009
7:08 PM
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PAUL RAMIREZ, answer is nope. I support MY region, which happens to be YOUR region too. I share some of your concerns, but I don't jump ship because it doesn't go my way. Don't put it out there then back down when asked to clarify your position. Can you please answer the questions I posed to you?
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PAUL R.
39 posts
Feb 12, 2009
7:15 PM
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IM HAVING FUN AGAIN. I GUESS THAT SUMS IT UP.
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Ballrollers
1753 posts
Feb 12, 2009
7:59 PM
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George,
Other than the basic Fly Rules and Fly Policy, it has always been the policy of the NBRC, and is still at this point in time, to intervene in the regional competitions as little as possible. I get verbal complaints about the things that go on in quite a number of regions from competition to competition. The policy is that if I get a written complaint with other flyers as witness, I will look into the matter further. It is up to the RD to conduct the regional competition. Hoefully he is in agreement with the majority of the flyers in the region. Most of the verbal complaints that I get are from a single individual that believes that he has been treated unfairly. Most problems are matters of poor communication. Cliff
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Scott
1726 posts
Feb 12, 2009
8:10 PM
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Cliff, what if a region is just "appointing" RDs by a few instead of not voting on them even though there are other canidates ? That is within the realm of the NBRCand the W/C director.
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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Ballrollers
1754 posts
Feb 12, 2009
8:18 PM
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Scott,
Again, if I got such a complaint, in writing, I would act on it. I have never had even a verbal complaint like that. I would imagine that a number of regions have RDs that are appointed because nobody else will take the job. I have not seen or heard of a region where a few flyers appointed an RD when somebody else also wanted to be considered. I would suggest that somebody is either pulling your leg or distorting the facts....but then I suppose I could be wrong. Like I said, I haven't heard of such a thing. I usually hear of regions where a flyer is very unhappy with the RD and the way he does things...I hear that all the time, in fact. It's probably the same with the World Cup, I imagine.
Cliff
Last Edited by on Feb 12, 2009 8:19 PM
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Scott
1729 posts
Feb 12, 2009
8:21 PM
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Not much that you can do about it then Cliff.
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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KATCHER
44 posts
Feb 12, 2009
8:35 PM
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this whole thing is working like a secret society!!! we need change!!
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gotspin7
2242 posts
Feb 13, 2009
4:29 AM
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If the time dont matter then I wonder why the so called SENIORS with the BETTER Birds dont ever let someone else Fly in the morning and the SENIORS with BETTER BIRDS fly in the afternooon .
George, I beleive that does not happen in my region and we are all always trying to keep it fair for everyone. The 2 regional directors on this side are old as heck but cool as heck too!...LOL
Good Luck bro!
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Sal Ortiz
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J_Star
1878 posts
Feb 13, 2009
5:20 AM
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It is always so easy to be part of the problem than being part of the solution. Everybody mown and complain, but no one has answers. No one wants to take the lead and resolve issues...Why...cus it is more fun to complain and act like you are a victim...We should not be airing our dirty launderary to the world to see…should we?
Jay
Last Edited by on Feb 13, 2009 5:21 AM
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Ballrollers
1755 posts
Feb 13, 2009
7:03 AM
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Good point,Jay.
Guys,
I'm not opposed to change.....by no means! My personal preerence is that the NBRC would set up a "Grievance Comittee" designed to hear complaints and resolve issues among its members. The problem is that, when it comes down to it, not many guys wish to sit in judgement of their fellow roller men. For most guys, this is a fun hobby and they do not wish to take part in anything that might detract from that.
The rules do state that, if a region has no RD, the NBRC president will appoint one. (He usually looks for volunteers, and so far we have been lucky enough to always get one in critical situations.)That is about all that is said on the subject in the Bylaws. The NBRC has very little to say on how a region operates, how they schedule a fly, select a judge, how the region funds its fly, etc., etc. The NBRC has a procedure in place for addressing regional questions. Three of the region's members must sign a statement outlining the problem, I think there may be a few other stipulations. This is presented by the region's RD and to the EC for diccussion. The NBRC usually takes the stand that each region is responsible for how that region operates.
Cliff
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Scott
1731 posts
Feb 13, 2009
10:03 AM
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What if there is more than one volunteer ? then it most certasinly has to be up for vote.
(The rules do state that, if a region has no RD, the NBRC president will appoint one. (He usually looks for volunteers, and so far we have been lucky enough to always get one in critical situations.)
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Just my Opinion
Scott
Last Edited by on Feb 13, 2009 10:04 AM
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Anthony
19 posts
Feb 13, 2009
10:59 AM
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The president appoints who he thinks will do the best job at that time. They are all volunteers. No one will take the job unless they want it. Remember the membership put the President into office to make these type decisions . The others that may be volunteering can file to run in the next election.
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Scott
1732 posts
Feb 13, 2009
11:01 AM
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I certainly hope that you are wrong about this happening if there is more than one willing to take on the position.
(The president appoints who he thinks will do the best job at that time)
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Just my Opinion
Scott
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silent187
400 posts
Feb 13, 2009
11:18 AM
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YEAH WE CAN ALL CMPLAIN BUT NOBODY DOING SHIT BOUT IT... THATS THE PROBLEM..
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BA Rollers
184 posts
Feb 13, 2009
1:22 PM
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Nobody's doing shit about what Silent?
Cliff, I find it highly unlikely that an RD will cooperate easily to forward a grievance against himself.
Scott, in this region nobody wants to be a RD because of the number of people who bitch about every little thing. While there are only a couple of people who actually support the RD, no one else wants to deal with the burden that often even they contribute to. Look at what happened this fall. Thankfully we had someone pick up the dropped reigns at the last minute.
I agree with Jay. People like to whine, moan and complain about everything. He's a cheater. That guy always gets the good times to fly. The RD is trying to screw me and my friends. The judge gave him a higher score because they have the same family of birds...etc, etc. We've heard it all.
The real story is some people don't like to see the same guys win. And when they continue to win or qualify under equal circumstances, someone MUST be cheating.
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George R.
1350 posts
Feb 13, 2009
1:52 PM
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"equal circumstances"
BA rollers are you sure things are equal if the guys that are always winning fly in the Morning?
Cliff
You are saying that it is whithin the rules for the RD to make whatever schedule they please.
Just a few months ago you were complaining about Pauls Fullertons region not flying all there kits in the Fall fly prelims BUT that was whithin the rules.
So I guess its ok to operate under the Rules when its only to your advantage HUH ?
George
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BA Rollers
185 posts
Feb 13, 2009
2:57 PM
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George, when there are only 5-7 guys flying a day, pretty much everyone is flying in the morning. Do you mean flying first? If so, can you name me one person in this region that has won the qualifying by flying first? Please educate me.
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Ballrollers
1757 posts
Feb 13, 2009
7:46 PM
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Brian,
You said it! I think these guys must be bored and looking for a fight! LOL! Guys, I repeat, I don't think I have ever seen two volunteers for RD from the same region at the same time.....we are always lucky to get just one! So I think it's best not to play "what if" games. From what I understand, and it is my opinion only, if the region has a person or persons that want the position, the region selects an p, when the elected VP resigned. That's how the By-laws indicate it is supposed to be handled.
It is always best to operate within the rules, but then we all must interpret the rules the same way or there is the possibility that it could put others at an advantage or disadvantage, if we don't. If we look at all the regions, we see differences in certain areas. Are all regions understanding the rules the same or not?... That is the question. DNFs are just another area where opinions can and do differ. Is it cheating? I don't think so, as I said before. Could the rules be better written better in order to avoid misunderstandings and confusion with the World Cup rules? Yes, I think so, very much so! I expect that one day the NBRC will endorse a 50% kits flown rule, but today no such rule exists, yet we have some regions operating as though it does, while most regions bust their ass to "TRY" to fly all kits entered. So we will deal with that at some point when the EC gets around to it. The opinions of members and flyers regarding a fly competition where kits count towards qualifiers but are not flown,..... DIFFERS and will continue to do so till all regions understand the rules the same way. That is my primary objective.....it's just another one of those gray areas that needs to be dealt with......
Cliff
Last Edited by on Feb 13, 2009 8:05 PM
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katyroller
345 posts
Feb 13, 2009
8:11 PM
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Read this whole thread and you will understand why some fanciers choose to only be backyard fliers, TOO MUCH B.S.!
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George R.
1351 posts
Feb 13, 2009
11:01 PM
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Katy
you might be right...
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