rollermanx0
251 posts
Jan 27, 2008
2:42 PM
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YES STAN PLONA???? WHAT IS THE BACKGROUND OF THIS FAMILY AND IS IT RELEVANT ...
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rOLLerManx0
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2008 2:43 PM
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rollerman132
221 posts
Jan 27, 2008
2:56 PM
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Plona birds go back J.Leroy Smith, at lest all mine do. I have a line of pure Plona birds and thy roll fast and deep,and are easy to manage.
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3757
529 posts
Jan 27, 2008
3:08 PM
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Stan Plona birds do go back to Bill Pensom, J. Leroy Smith and Jim Skidmore.
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Mount Airy Lofts
404 posts
Jan 27, 2008
3:53 PM
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I only wish they were easy to manage. High flying is deeply in bedded in mine. Strong is all I can say about this family. Handles all kinds of weather conditions with ease.
Thor
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rollermanx0
252 posts
Jan 27, 2008
3:57 PM
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well this is a straight PLONA BIRD GREAT PRODUCER!
NOT APART OF WHAT I'M BREEDING
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rOLLerManx0
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rollerman132
223 posts
Jan 27, 2008
4:09 PM
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Nice looking bird rollmanx0, looks like one of my kit birds.
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rollerman132
224 posts
Jan 27, 2008
4:12 PM
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Thor
who did you get yours from? if you dont mind me asking, and what are you feeding them?
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2008 4:13 PM
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Mount Airy Lofts
405 posts
Jan 27, 2008
4:22 PM
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Steve,
When I hear people say straight... they don't actually mean that it was bred by the man himself do they? If so, last time I checked, the last birds out of Stan's loft were in 1979. Which happens to be one year after I was born. A lot of Stan's top birds made it to Minnesota. Some were purchased by a gentleman named Tom Stone of PA during multiple visits to Stan's loft (looking at the pedigree's these birds were the top performing birds in Stan's kits) and the main breeders were birds David Kowalski picked up after Stans funeral. I don't know the exact deal but some went to Mr. Kowalski and some went to Thomas H. Hatcher.
Thor
P.S. Tom Stone in turn sold his stuff to the Minnesota Fliers. Plona bred and first generations...
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2008 4:26 PM
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rollermanx0
254 posts
Jan 27, 2008
4:24 PM
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YOU'RE CORRECT! IT WASN'T BRED BY HIM..BUT THE BREEDER SAID THAT, THAT'S THE FAMILY THIS BIRD COMES FROM...
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rOLLerManx0
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rollerman132
225 posts
Jan 27, 2008
4:36 PM
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I got mine form a guy who had some of Plona last kit(1978,1979) birds. Tom Stone had some real nice Plona birds back in the day.
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Mount Airy Lofts
406 posts
Jan 27, 2008
4:41 PM
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My foundation breeders were from two gentleman named Dick Nauer and Gail Peterson. Dicks birds were mostly Tom Stone (of PA) bred, Stan Plona (of PA) bred, David Kowalski (at this time he resided in MN) bred, John White (of Iowa) or Gail Peterson (of MN). Gails were straight out of Stan Plona or J. Leroy Smith loft. All the fliers above purchased birds from Stan or J. Leroy Smith directly. My birds that are heavy line bred in the Smiths are from Mr. Peterson as he had purchased multiple birds off J. Leroy Smith back in the early 70's.
There is also a mentioned of a gentleman in Michigan who purchased these same birds by the name of Tom F. As I have been told, he has the same family as myself. In fact I have a pedigree which mentions a TF banded bird.
Feed is straight wheat with 1/3 straight milo. Upping the milo when needed.
Hope this helps...
Thor
P.S. I know nothing about what Thomas H. Hatcher had. All I know is what I read from his books.
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2008 4:48 PM
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Mount Airy Lofts
407 posts
Jan 27, 2008
4:46 PM
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Steve,
Thanks for clearing that up. Got me confused there for a second.
Thor
P.S. Your Red Bar resembles the stuff I am flying from Don Ouellette's Plona side stuff.
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2008 5:05 PM
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Mount Airy Lofts
408 posts
Jan 27, 2008
4:57 PM
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Steve,
Do you know a gentleman by the name of Darryl Wylie? He had purchased most of Dick Nauer's birds when Dick got out of Rollers. He has the parents to my Foundation cock bird with this purchase. He got some primo stuff. I think his buddy Hank Johnson has some of Jim Fisher's stuff which is off from Dick's birds.
Thor
P.S. Are all those trophies (I noticed it from one of your many posted photos) from winning Roller flies? If so, how do I sign up "_"
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2008 5:18 PM
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3757
530 posts
Jan 27, 2008
5:02 PM
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Thor - TF stands for Tom Fricano who also had birds directly from Stan Plona. Also, the meaning of straight usually means in the pigeon world that the birds have not been crossed with any other line and are close to the originals. Let's not argue about semantics.
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Mount Airy Lofts
409 posts
Jan 27, 2008
5:07 PM
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I didn't know how to spell his last name. I have heard his name mentioned a couple of times by a gentle man here. Stating that Tom F. and he shared birds on occasion.
I was just pulling Steve's chain about the STRAIGHT part...
Thanks for clearing the last name part out.
Thor
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3757
531 posts
Jan 27, 2008
5:16 PM
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No problem thor. I have a question. How long have you worked with the Plona strain? I have some friends that also work with this family and they are great spinners. My Pensom strain birds have a lot of Plona in the background from the brokenwing hen.
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rollerman132
226 posts
Jan 27, 2008
5:21 PM
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I hope what I'm about say is not going to piss anyone off,but out of the three Tom’s the birds with best body type were Hatcher’s (before he cross them), Fricano and stone’s birds were a little on the big side.
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3757
532 posts
Jan 27, 2008
5:26 PM
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Tom Stones birds would smoke. I have to agree the ones I handled in California were not the best looking birds and in the hand as they were a little longcast but could they spin!!!!! One of my friend who is a type nut had to agree that those Tom Stone birds were awesome in the air.
Last Edited by on Jan 05, 2009 6:15 AM
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Mount Airy Lofts
410 posts
Jan 27, 2008
5:34 PM
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I saw this family in the air for the first time in '99. Picked it up in '01 and had it since. Took me a couple of years to select what I really wanted to work with as there was a lot of blood within this family to choose from. I ended up choosing two main blood line within the family. This was from flying and observing the performance given. I still don't know how things will turn out but the future looks bright. This will be my 3rd season breeding this particular line.
They are just as good as any thing out there. All tho for some reason, the highest velocity Rollers all ways had the high flying tendencies. What I have found or seems to be true is that my stuff also tend to be more of an individual type performer - meaning they do not give the natural huge breaks as some of the other top families I have seen. Loose kitting is common as well. Even knowing this, I am sticking with them for the long run.
Thor
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rollerman132
227 posts
Jan 27, 2008
5:44 PM
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There was a bird that Stone was partial to, and was seen in most of his pedigrees. If I remember correctly the birds name was strawberry, is that the bird on any of your pedigrees Thor?
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3757
533 posts
Jan 27, 2008
5:59 PM
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Thor - I never had an issue with loose kitting but you have to remember the Pensom lines (Smith, Plona, Bill Pensom etc) were bred for high velocity and style. They were not bred for breaks. I am glad that you are sticking with it as so many go with what is popular.
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COYOTE33
40 posts
Jan 27, 2008
6:09 PM
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HEY! Thor
i would like to know what parents i have of your foundation cock.
your are wright i did get nice birds from dick nauer and they are pure plona's
i did talk to to Gail peterson at one time. these birds are hot and nice spinners.
also hank johnson is not a good buddy of my i did know him, you might be talking about hank lumpskin.
darryl wylie
aka coyote33
ps i also have the dick stephen,tom hatcher continetals
Last Edited by on Jan 27, 2008 6:14 PM
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Mount Airy Lofts
413 posts
Jan 28, 2008
7:57 AM
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...123,
I sort of kept away from the Tom Stone stuff. Had on hand 10 or so Tom Stone banded birds a couple of years ago. Most went barren after just one or two rounds. Lost all of the youngsters out of them to an over fly/hawk. There is one particular bird that I am still breeding on the side. He is a son off Tom Stone's 1986 AU 630. This '86 bird as I knew it was still filling eggs last season. He is an old, old 'Un if he made it threw this Winter. I am lucky, the son I am breeding is only a '00 bred and still have many years left in him. This line has a lot of velocity but lack the frequency you need to score points in the flies. Sad but true for now.
I was not a big fan of the Stone side of this family. Most of what I flew was high fliers. I might add that the straight Tom Stone birds I had on hand did not get enough years at my place to fully evaluate them but just what I saw at the time. Type is out of the books for these birds. Ugly as heck. Velocity and style is by far the only thing these birds possessed, well at least from what I saw.
All I have are band numbers for back ground info (unless they were the parents to my current stock) > if you can give me the Straw Berry bird's band number I can tell you if I do or don't. Tom Stone thought a lot of the 1986 Blue Check Mark 630 Cock that is residing at my guy's loft. All I can say is that it is one heck of a producer for Velocity and Style. Hope to score a daughter off him this year.
Thor
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3757
537 posts
Jan 28, 2008
8:39 AM
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Thor - You are right on the Tom Stone birds I handled were ugly as sin but they do have the motor.
Also, check your pedigree information again. You listed JLS in 1977 and I assumed you meant J.Leroy Smith? If this is so this is incorrect as he died in 1969. If it is another JLS then I stand to be corrected.
Last Edited by on Jan 05, 2009 6:16 AM
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Fire_Baller_916
79 posts
Jan 28, 2008
9:13 AM
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Hank Johnson flew Fireballs at the time too...By any chance did he ever cross the Plona with Fireballs???
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Chai
Raining Fire Loft
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3757
538 posts
Jan 28, 2008
9:21 AM
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Chai - I am not sure but this is why I am such a strict believer in individual pens. Thank God for my father who raises Giant Buff rabbits, quails and Rhode Island Red chickens and he always taught me to raise my birds in an individual pen. If not there are big questions just like the one you just asked?
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rollermanx0
256 posts
Jan 28, 2008
9:31 AM
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THOR, YES THOSE ARE FLY THOPHIES....! FINALLY..LOL!
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rOLLerManx0
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Fire_Baller_916
80 posts
Jan 28, 2008
9:35 AM
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Im an open loft guy but all my birds are all close related...I dont need to worry about my birds pairing up with other birds in my loft...As long as there all pure and from the same family...Now days it's hard to come upon pure birds due to the fact of cross breeding...Which birds on the long run have better stamina and are more stable flyer...Pure or Cross breed???
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Chai
Raining Fire Loft
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2008 9:38 AM
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rollermanx0
259 posts
Jan 28, 2008
9:51 AM
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chai,but what about your pedigrees??how can you make up true pedigrees if you can't be sure what cock fathered the offspring?? just curious...
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rOLLerManx0
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Fire_Baller_916
81 posts
Jan 28, 2008
10:06 AM
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My pedigree is in my head...I only breed from a very few breeders and know which birds come from which birds...They are all close related...So dont matter to me about pedigree...Not all breeders out there have pedigree on there birds right???
Chai
Raining Fire Loft
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2008 10:11 AM
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COYOTE33
41 posts
Jan 28, 2008
1:12 PM
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Hey Thor!
beleive it are not the old boy is still living, the hen died two years ago but i still have sons out of the two and grandson and granddaughters. when i got the birds from dick he gave me the pedigrees as well. no i wouldnt give up my pure
plona's for anything, they are a very fast family with style. i was a good friend of dick stephens, actually a very close friend, when he died he wanted me to recieve his continental family he got from tom hatcher, so i have booth families.
call me i'm in the NBRC bulletin or email me @ blazario@pacbell.net and i'll get you the pedigrees on that family.
coyote
a.k.a darryl wylie
ps gail peterson didnt believe anyone from calif knew of the 202 stuff when we talked.
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2008 1:17 PM
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Mount Airy Lofts
414 posts
Jan 28, 2008
1:18 PM
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I know what I did... :) It should read NBRC (not JLS) bred by GBP for both.
2237 Red Grizzle w/f Cock (writes: foundation stock cock from Stan Plona line) is off 1973 PRC 17025 (SP) Red Grizzzle w/f Cock x 1974 PRC 16297 (SP) Black Check w/f Hen
2217 Black Snip w/f Hen (writes: good producer for several years) - all the Grand Parents were Plona breds.
That got me curious so I had to look up my original pedigrees. Thanks for catching it. I wrote out so many pedigrees that year that there were bond to be mistakes. The original pedigree's that came with the birds should read correct.
Thanks for catching it... the pedigree design you see there was some thing I put together a couple of years ago. Actually I was given a few by a veteran Roller Flier friend of mine. I had it printed on a 4 x 6 photo paper and stuffed it in a photo album.
Thor
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3757
540 posts
Jan 28, 2008
1:24 PM
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Thor - No problem at all. Tell Gail there are some old time Pensomites still left here in California and tell him I said hello. Gail knows who I am. I think Darryl knows Gail also but I could be mistaken.
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2008 1:25 PM
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Mount Airy Lofts
416 posts
Jan 28, 2008
1:36 PM
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Chai,
What I meant was Hank Lumpskin not Johnson as Coyote had corrected. Must of had Johnson stuck in my head from all those Johnson fliers out there.
Sorry,
Thor
Last Edited by on Jan 28, 2008 1:37 PM
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3757
541 posts
Jan 28, 2008
1:37 PM
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Thor - Is that John White?
Dr. LD
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Mount Airy Lofts
417 posts
Jan 28, 2008
1:42 PM
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LD,
Nope... never met the man. He was before my time. This is John Johnson's trophy room.
I hear John White is getting out of birds. Sadden to hear this as I have heard great stories about the birds he is able to put up from this family.
Thor
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Mount Airy Lofts
422 posts
Jan 30, 2008
1:29 PM
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Don't know if Tony will allow this photo or not but gonna try posting it any ways.
This is the only Tom Stone line I have left. Well what I choose to continue to breed from his line. The rest are from the MN family base Plona side.
2000 - 2675 Cock - The only white eyed bird I have. Heard white eyes are no good. This one proves them wrong.
1986 Tom Stone 630 Cock - Took this photo two years ago. He just returned from Oregon (from Ivan Hatchett's loft). Father to 2675 up above. Showing his age 20 years old in 2006.
1998 Tom Stone 2730 Hen - All I know is she is one heck of a producer. Tom Stone had only good things to say about her as I heard. Mother to 2675 up above.
Last Edited by on Jan 30, 2008 1:33 PM
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COYOTE33
44 posts
Jan 31, 2008
6:44 AM
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nice birds Thor,i like the cock with the white eyes.
i bread i dun almost like him out of a plona pair, i beleive he has white eyes. i get a lot of white eye birds out of my plona family, as a matter of fact the full brother to your cock has white eyes.
anyway i got your email, i'll talk to you soon
coyote
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bigwilly
297 posts
Jan 31, 2008
7:40 AM
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hey Steve looks like a Ruby roller
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nicksiders
2517 posts
Jan 31, 2008
11:39 AM
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It seems that everything in North American comes out of Plona, Smith, Pensom. Somehow, some way, you will find it. Bruce Cooper, Borges, Niebel, Norwood, Hatcher, Kiser, on and on it goes and in the year 2008 it is still here.
Nick
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3757
553 posts
Jan 31, 2008
12:05 PM
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Nick - I am glad you are back!
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Good Times Roll
2 posts
Feb 02, 2008
5:15 AM
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 This is a pic of Tom Stone
And the parents to Strawberry PRC-71-14686 x PRC-79-3886 My first of posting pics so it sucks lol
Last Edited by on Feb 02, 2008 5:21 AM
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Good Times Roll
3 posts
Feb 02, 2008
5:24 AM
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A couple grand kids of 86-660 "Strawberry"
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Good Times Roll
4 posts
Feb 02, 2008
1:42 PM
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Another down from 86-660
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Good Times Roll
5 posts
Feb 02, 2008
2:01 PM
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A Kowalski Smith bird lots of 11228 and 1618 x 1647
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Mount Airy Lofts
434 posts
Feb 03, 2008
9:45 AM
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Good times...,
That Red Bar looks like a Hen I had here at one time. She was a bird I called Strawberry Bar bred by Tom Stone. Only got one round from her before she went barren on me. Lost that round to the sky sharks before I saw anything.
1995 AU 20311 Ash Red Bar Hen bred by Tom Stone
Did not get any thing off her to inquire her back ground. All tho from the photos you provided, she looks to be off his Strawberry line.
Thor
P.S. Dam she was one ugly looking bird as to type wise.
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Mount Airy Lofts
436 posts
Feb 03, 2008
2:23 PM
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Good Times..,
Any chance I can look at more of your photos?
here is my email khaos_thor@hotmail.com
Man for the Tom Stone birds, you have some darn good looking birds. The ones I have seen are no where near what you have there. That 14686 and 14687 are in many, many of my birds.
I hear Tom Stone had a bird called Old Peg Leg. Have you heard of this bird?
Thor
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Good Times Roll
8 posts
Feb 03, 2008
6:39 PM
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Thor
Here is PRC-76-9642 AKA "Peg" bred by Stan Plona and owned by Tom Stone and then to John White, I do have more pics I can send you,when I scan them though they dont come out very big,The red bar grizzle is a cock RLF-03-122
RL
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Good Times Roll
11 posts
Feb 03, 2008
7:21 PM
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Thor
Who is the red bar hen out of? I had 86-636 tortoishell hen from Tom a sister to Strawberry I also had Killer and his bro.
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smoke747
752 posts
Feb 04, 2008
12:13 AM
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nICE BIRDS GOOD TIMES
SMOKE747
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