Gregg
53 posts
Apr 01, 2007
10:17 AM
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Marcus,
I can speak to the sixties and seventies. I saw the results of the sixties and was breeding rollers from about seventy on. No one raises good birds the way you described, not even Pensom. It is not easy now and wasn't easy then. Was Pensom a genius with the Birmingham Roller, Yes! But he also raised his share of culls. Sold his share of culls also. Oops, heresy. History doesn't record the crap birds, it remembers the champions.
The only thing is that we didn't have the predators then as we do now so we got to see the results of our breeding program on a regular basis. Today, when half or more of your production ends up shark food or scared to another county or state by the continuous harassment, getting a true picture of what a pair is capable of producing is sometimes very difficult.
Gregg.
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DeepSpinLofts
17 posts
Apr 01, 2007
12:15 PM
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Milo & Gregg... I think most of the roller breeders/flyers in the Pensom-Whittingham era were focused on style, depth and pure athleticism like many of the roller folks today.
...however
The desire to make pretty show rollers and admiration of illustrous colors to please the eyeballs of many roller breeders/flyers.... may have had an affect on the ability to produce higher percentages of champion spinners. That and the predators which Gregg speaks of.
If we select stock birds simply by performance standards only (disregarding color) then I think a competitive edge in flying kits with the style judges like to see in the air can be accomplished.
Just my opinion.
Marcus
Last Edited by on Sep 11, 2008 12:22 PM
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CSRA
107 posts
Apr 01, 2007
1:22 PM
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Hey milo you must have at least 30 years in this sport if not let me know how many
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Planet_Rock_Lofts
64 posts
Apr 01, 2007
5:09 PM
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Damn,
50's, 60's and 70's?? Well I was born in the 50's, late 60's I was born and the 70's I was oblivious to roller pigeons.
Planet Rock Lofts
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CSRA
112 posts
Apr 01, 2007
8:02 PM
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well milo i may have seen one champion in my life time maybe two
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nicksiders
1519 posts
Apr 01, 2007
8:27 PM
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I have seen one champion.....it was in Mt. Zion, Illinois in 1978. It was a rec. red spangle. It was a hen.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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DeepSpinLofts
18 posts
Apr 01, 2007
10:13 PM
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23 Years huh Milo?
Had my 1st roller at age 10 in 1975.
...but
Didn't get serious until age 18 when I ordered some Fireballs from Harry Ashcroft of Ohio. Harry had a certified champion roller called Foxfire. Never saw the bird roll... but it did produce some good birds that I was fortunate to get back then. Those Fireballs can be some fairly good performers if you can work'em right.
The fastest spinners I've ever seen were some Jaconettes that Richard Jaconette shipped to me years ago.
It's getting late... going to get some sleep. Gotta be up at 4:30 a.m. to do the bird thing and check out Squawk Box on CNBC with Joe Kernon & Becky Quick
Take care....
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on May 02, 2007 7:12 PM
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motherlodelofts
1655 posts
Apr 02, 2007
10:29 AM
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Marcus , I think the word "champion" was used pretty loosely by many , the days are gone where all you have to do is talk a good game , now you actualy have to fly them and let the birds themself do the talking.
Scott
Last Edited by on Apr 02, 2007 10:30 AM
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Hector Coya
144 posts
Apr 02, 2007
2:23 PM
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How can someone call a bird Champion when it hasnt competed individually agains another bird?
Unless we have indevidual champion compatition all we have is champion kit's.
Call it like it is.
My opinion,Hector Coya
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motherlodelofts
1658 posts
Apr 02, 2007
2:42 PM
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Now hold on Milo , that would put him at what ? 42 , and you consider that old ?
Then what does that make ol Nick ? LOL LOL
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DeepSpinLofts
20 posts
Apr 02, 2007
5:07 PM
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I agree 100% Scott. The word "champion" was undoubtfully utilized loosely by many of the old timers who flirted around with the imports. The way I see it, most of the people around here probably have some fairly decent birds... but then again I might just be wrong about that.
Hey Hector, you make a valid statement. I say to folks fly'em to show the goods... or go into raising tumblers. he...he...he...
{P.S.} Milo I'm not going to delete your posts. You have a lot of valuable knowledge to offer in regards to the Birmingham Roller profession... and I truly appreciate your input.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
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nicksiders
1526 posts
Apr 02, 2007
7:11 PM
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LMAO....screw you guys. Someday you will be old.....maybe.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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DeepSpinLofts
22 posts
Apr 03, 2007
4:02 AM
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Breeding a champion cock to a champion hen?
I was wondering does anyone know if there were a pair of champions bred together to produce a family of quality spinners.
...if so
What family of rollers.... or should I say who is the breeder to perform this feat?
Was it Pensom? McCully? Harter? Graham? Plona? Hilton? Borges? Kiser? Smith? Perkins? Whittingham? Roettenbacher? Turner? Reed? Evans? Grover? Jaconette? Oullette? Neible? Mason? Higgins?
Who???
There's a lot of data pertaining to the pursuit of breeding high velocity, fast spinning & deep rolling pigeons that I am unknowing about. I've learned over the years that asking questions is one way to learn important things.
Nothing else comes to mind right now. Oh well it's early.... so let me go and wake up with a hot cup of chamomile herbal tea.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on Jul 10, 2008 1:39 PM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1248 posts
Apr 03, 2007
6:11 AM
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An oddity of nature? As champion rollers are so few and far between, they must simply be an oddity of nature that pops up from time to time in lofts where the general stock quality is high already?
If we are all breeding for champions (the ultimate goal) then we must be some really frustrated pigeon fanciers because it is so out of the range of predictability when one will pop up. Shame we have to deal with such inferior birds all the time, everyday in our quest for the holy grail???
How far is the best bird in your loft from being a champion? Is it only a "champion" in the air? Or is it only a champion from the breeder loft? Or is it a champion in both?
How many attributes and at what level constitutes a champion roller? Has the NBRC put out a quantifiable standard as to what a champion is? Has someone or a group tried to quantify the qualities and attributes of a true champion?
Shouldn't the newbie at least have a precise target in which to shoot for but probably never hit?
Roller Ramblings...
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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motherlodelofts
1659 posts
Apr 03, 2007
6:57 AM
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I don't even use the word "champion" , I just look to breed hard spinning solid Birmingham Rollers , and once in a while I get one that is exceptional , but for how long ? hmmmm there is one to ponder
Scott
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1249 posts
Apr 03, 2007
8:28 AM
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Here's some more Roller Ramblings...How long before a champion is not a champion? Does it have to go 2 years in the air? Or should it be 3 or more?
What percentage of offspring should be champions before it is considered a champion of the stock pen? If there IS a certain percentage, if so, then it IS predictable afterall?? Which would mean we should be able to produce champions as needed??
If a champion is produced from a champion then it follows that it will produce champions and so on?? Then producing champions should be common place unless someone hoards them away creating a false shortage?
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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DeepSpinLofts
23 posts
Apr 03, 2007
9:32 AM
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Hi Tony...
I was merely pondering about a few things. This is just a hypothetical supposition and nothing more.
Suppose you had a champion hen and Kumro had a champion cock.
....now
What if you roller men were to collaborate a champion breeding program by mating these 2 awesome birds together for life (with interim breaks to relax the hen's egg sac)?
What percentage of young from this champion pair do you think will be high caliber performers considering:
1) They have similar body type
2) Excellent control on a tight roll
3) Extremely high velocity on the spin
4) The babies (in the kit-box) will be fed a special pigeon formula equivalent to anabolic muscle stimulators that human body builders & professional atheletes use?
There's always a way to inprove an athlete.... it doesn't matter if it's a professional football player, horse, racing greyhound or racing pigeon.
What do ya think?
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on Apr 03, 2007 9:33 AM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1250 posts
Apr 03, 2007
9:35 AM
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Hey Milo, to me, a "good" roller is a roller that would be scorable in competition. The degree of its quality (good-very good-champion in the air) will be in its ability to consistently perform better than its kitmates.
Since there is no official body that has created a specific standard, all one can do is determine his best bird and then LABEL it a champion (in his loft).
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Last Edited by on Apr 03, 2007 9:43 AM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1251 posts
Apr 03, 2007
9:42 AM
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Hey Marcus, I don't agree with your premise, and that is that 2 "champions" from different lofts will produce well together.
I would rather have the Kumro cock and its mother, breed them togther and take the hen daughter and put it back on the father and start line breeding.
It is my opinion that this line-breeding method will increase the odds/percentages of producing good birds over time and allow me to sculpt the family to my ideal Birmingham Roller.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1252 posts
Apr 03, 2007
9:51 AM
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But to play along, 70% to 80% will be good birds, 10% to 15% will be very good birds and 5% to 10% will be "champions"?
These percentages apply to the level of quality within this loft.
The 70% to 80% of good birds in this loft may very well be "champions" in another loft. Am I making sense???
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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motherlodelofts
1660 posts
Apr 03, 2007
9:57 AM
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"The subjectivity of roll speed, style, wing placement, frequency, and many other factors make it a loose term. "
Milo , I think that the only time it becomes subjective is when you have those that don't any better in the mix.
I have yet to see good rollermen not to be able to all agree on an exceptional bird.
The one's that aren't that good just can't see it , all they see is a bird rolling and depth usualy becomes the determining factor.
As for your question Tony , that is why the word is meaningless to me , to me for a bird to have value it has to have staying power year after year , to me good young birds are only potential and nothing more.
These birds will go through several changes and phases on into maturity , I find that the good one's get better as far as qaulity and in some cases depth in the second and third year , it is like they accept the roll and know thier limitations.
I think that exceptional birds are a fluke , but everything has to be right for it to happen , so natualy you won't see such birds popping out of just anything either, the stock that you breed out of determines your chances of breeding such birds.
Scott
Scott
Last Edited by on Apr 03, 2007 9:58 AM
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nicksiders
1533 posts
Apr 03, 2007
9:58 AM
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Let me tell you a little side note to the story about this champion roller I witnessed. Bob Hord was with me when this bird put on this amazing show. When this amazing creature landed and we discovered it was a hen(of course the owner already knew it was a hen) by the behavior of the cocks in the kit, old Bob said to me so nobody else could hear "if that bird was a cock you would have something" and then he went on to inform me "that bird has potential".
It is funny how Bob never acknowleges totally a great performer especialy in his own birds. His birds never have more than just "potential". They could be four years old and just still have "potential".
Now, who does this remind you of that is often in this forum? Bob Hord is an older version of two people that come into mind.......LMAO.
I don't know what this story has to do with this thread, but maybe some of us are too tight with the word "champion". We don't want want to say it or attach it to a lot of birds because we all know nobody and no bird is perfect everyday. There has to be some champions in a champion kit....don't there?
It may be there are more champions out there than we want to admit. Maybe that rec. red spangled hen was just the BEST I have ever seen and not the only CHAMPION I have ever seen.
Maybe.
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
Last Edited by on Apr 03, 2007 10:02 AM
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J_Star
839 posts
Apr 03, 2007
10:01 AM
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Tony, I agree with your opinion on the line breeding methodogy.
The rest of you...define a champion and lets see what it means to each.
Jay
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motherlodelofts
1661 posts
Apr 03, 2007
10:03 AM
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One more to ponder , why do good birds only tumble, flip, or not roll at all when too low ? and yet when at a safe ht those same bird can hammer 25 - 40 ft , amazing little birds here !!!
Scott
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DeepSpinLofts
24 posts
Apr 03, 2007
11:19 AM
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Yes Tony... it made a lot of sense.
I feel intellectually uplifted with those percentages of quality spinners you forecasted from the champion hen/cock.
Hmm....
If I can just get me hands on a champion cock and champion hen to start my bio-genetic molecular research on the roller pigeon.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on Apr 10, 2007 3:44 AM
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Ballrollers
757 posts
Apr 03, 2007
3:33 PM
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All this talk about breeding a true champion is sorta like talkin' about how to win the lottery isn't it?....and about the same odds, I'd say. I think I'll just focus my efforts on tightening up the gene pool around consistant, qualty performers, and if one shows up (a true champion), well, I'll figure, I just got lucky and the genes happened to fall together just right. I haven't seen anyone with any real shortcuts yet......
YITS,
Cliff
Last Edited by on Apr 03, 2007 3:59 PM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1255 posts
Apr 03, 2007
3:49 PM
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Hey Cliff, you are right. Work around a quality gene-pool and you will have everything you need to develop and maintain a "world class" stud of birds.
I got criticised once for using that term in describing my birds one time on the NBRC chat board. I think I remember who it was too. But no names! LOL
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
1299 posts
Apr 03, 2007
4:06 PM
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"The rest of you...define a champion and lets see what it means to each."
Jay, I think this is the meat of the discussion about what a Champion is or could be.
We each have our own view of what makes up a bird that the person sees as being the best of the best. The most important thing is that usually the bar of acceptance changes for each person over time. As a person gains more experience their level of "ideal" changes. I can say that what I thought was a high-class spinner many years ago isn't the same quality of roller I consider in that category now. And I expect that years from now my interpretation of the highest quality will most likely be a little different and more discerning than it currently is. I am the toughest judge of my own birds. Most of the time I don't care for their performance because my standard is too high.
Personally I don't care for the label of Champion in rollers. Publicly it is just a label granted by several opinions to place some level of value or accomplishment upon the bird/breeder. Some people seek to see champion-level quality in their birds while others seek to have others recognize them for having raised and flown a bird that peers liked so much they granted it the highest honor that they want others to respect. To me the label of Champion in the big picture is just the whim of egotistical fancy. Maybe it gives the owner a sense of achievement to have a bird that someone other than themselves dub as one of the best spinners ever, or of that caliber.
To answer your question Jay, my definition of a "champion" spinner is a bird that excells in pretty much every performance area. By excell I mean it performs on a level that fits into the realm of where I believe a bird could not perform any better. The spin quality is one of those actions that leaves the person, regardless of experience, breathless. I don't mean "wow", I mean "breathless". It is fluid in performance and confident in character. It shows steadfast devotion to the team and is a member of the team, not just a pigeon flying in a world by itself. It manages well and responds well to that management. It knows when to say "when" and when to let it all hang out for guts and glory.
The real bottom line with a bird that can be described along the lines of what a top quality roller would be is it is clearly and without hesitation a bird that represents the bird we would like to a full kit of.
I have several birds I am fond of and if I wanted to could say I believe their performance was in the realm of the best. My Rocket hen was to this day one of the fastest spinners I have ever raised and was a dedicated team member with no baby-ing requirements. I never flew her past one year so I have no idea how she would have ended up later on. That taints any aspirations I have for her being a tried and true top champ. But on the other hand I am grateful I did park her because her daughter is the variable to her being "one of" and singularly the best. Her daughter was an phenomenal spinner, so much so she made my other kit birds look below average. A black donut for 40+ feet every time. A truly amazing pigeon I've yet to recreate though she does have a daughter this year showing some promise.
But one thing that is a constant when we see a bird that extends into that realm of utmost excellence is that we can always find a fault if we look hard enough. I am truly a believer that I will never have the "perfect" roller.
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CSRA
115 posts
Apr 03, 2007
5:10 PM
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Brian very well put together keep up the hard work CSRA!
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DeepSpinLofts
25 posts
Apr 03, 2007
5:30 PM
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MCCORMICKLOFTS is Brian? If so... that was very enlightening and so good I decided to read it twice.
"A black donut for 40+ feet every time"
That sounds sweet!
Marcus
DeepSpinLofts
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J_Star
844 posts
Apr 04, 2007
5:33 AM
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Brian,
I agree with your description of a champion roller. But I was hoping that you be the last to respond to the description of champion because you have an excellent writing skills and way of explaining things with an extra ordinary writing skills. That way others won’t just copy from your description.
My point is every fancier will describe a champion different than the other due of the way they compare a bird with the rest of the birds and the way they understand things and their level of experience. My understanding is others would have different meaning of a champion to them when comparing with the rest of their birds or birds of other fanciers around them. For that reason the word ‘Champion’ is used loosely.
What I conclude is either champions come a dime a dozen or fanciers are not taking their “Champion” rollers to the stock loft; therefore, there are tons of them flying in kits around the USA.
Thanks Brian for your explanation.
Jay
Last Edited by on Apr 04, 2007 5:34 AM
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W@yne
335 posts
Apr 04, 2007
12:58 PM
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Brian ,
I think you summed up a true champion roller as realistic as anyone possibly can. I don't think many can add to your post describing a champion roller because ive tried but although worded different still was on very similar lines although your description sounds a lot more interesting to read than what i had to put Lol. I should of tried harder at school lol. J star i don't think anyone needs to copy Brians post as there's only so much you can say of a champion roller its the full package that's what you are looking for the complete roller. Any experience flyer will know what to look for in a champion bird.
Regards
W@yne uk
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Patience Perseverance Perfection
=====================================
Last Edited by on Apr 04, 2007 1:21 PM
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Velo99
1029 posts
Apr 04, 2007
5:17 PM
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I didn`t really want to chime in on this one because I don`t have any "champion" birds and probably never will. I am like BMC in my approach to standards of performance.
This is my take as to what achampion should be.
Good/outstanding as a YB
Outstanding in the A team
Outstanding in the breeder loft,producing like itself.
Minumum 5 seasons in the A team.
Since some of the standards are subjective, I will not quibble with actual figures but more along the ethereal.
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V99
Flippin`The Bird!
http://www.bluedotloft.50megs.com
Last Edited by on Apr 04, 2007 5:18 PM
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DeepSpinLofts
38 posts
Apr 07, 2007
9:27 AM
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Some very interesting input by many of you (especially Tony & Brian)
My view of a champion Birmingham Roller is a genetically well bred and high class caliber of bird that stands out against every other aerial performer known to man. The very glimpse of a champion roller in the air will be a jaw dropping, heart stopping experience for the onlooker. In rolling style the champion should rapidly spin with a lightning flash blur portraying a small tennis shaped ball that has a very small hole in the center. All champion rollers should spin downwards smoothly for a considerable distance from the kit (of at least 20ft or more), then cleanly breaking out of the roll.... only to majesticly return to the kit and do it all over again... several times better than it had rolled earlier.
Now keep in mind folks that the presence of the hole indicates true perfection on the spin... and the tighter the spin the better. Without proper spinning, the roller is either rolling inappropriately (too slowly) or the roll is unsatisfactory for champion credentials and these rollers will never achieve championship status. After about 14-18 months, a true champion roller has been vigorously tested and is now routinely prepared to control the depth of the spin while descending rapidly from the kit in proper rolling fashion. If there are no accidents (say predators or something), a champion roller should be able to put on a magnificently marvelous aerial show right up into their old age. From what I've seen over the years, there is no other class of aerial performers that gives so much joy and rewarding satisfaction as the performance bred Birmingham Roller.
NOTE: Most important is that it must not only be a champion in the air, but the bird must also be a grand champion in the breeding pen with the genetic capability to produce a high percentage of quality spinners.
.....so
If any of you are ever fortunate enough to get your hands on a champion Birmingham Roller pigeon, covet it, for it is dearly worth its weight in GOLD!
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on Apr 07, 2007 3:46 PM
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DeepSpinLofts
39 posts
Apr 08, 2007
9:47 AM
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The 514 Spangle hen.
QUESTION: I'm not for certain, but wasn't this Pensom Roller a champion performer?
The reason I ask because I just picked up a 15ft-30ft top notch Red/White badge pearl-eyed spinner that has nothing but pure linebred 514 (champion genes I think) in here blood.
Working on a major frequency project and wanted to know if anybody around here has experienced success working with the 514 Hilton line.
Only serious breeders with concrete answers apply. The reason being is because I only work with quality birds bred from superb bloodlines by competent breeders who understands the time and effort it takes to breed a champion performer.
....therefore
Any knowledgeable feedback that can help provide positive solutions would be deeply appreciated.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on Apr 08, 2007 9:49 AM
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nicksiders
1558 posts
Apr 08, 2007
9:55 AM
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OKAY
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Snicker Rollers
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Missouri-Flyer
470 posts
Apr 08, 2007
10:00 AM
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hey Marcus,
following many of your post, you appear to be an intelligent guy...
Your last post here lost me tho, and came off kinda prickish!
If I may ask, what is your last name so I can look at the past fly results and see how well you have done? Thanks
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Jerry
Home of "Whispering Wings Loft"
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DeepSpinLofts
40 posts
Apr 08, 2007
10:23 AM
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Hey Jerry...
My last name is Freeman and my website is listed on the NBRC member website. I'm 41 and been around rollers since I was 10 years old.
I haven't competed for the W/C yet because simply not ready to show my stuff yet. I have a sense of pride and refuse to put up a kit that isn't worth the judges time... energy... financial expense... and other things.
Most of my birds are similar in family and body type to Dave Henderson & Joe Urbon and Keith London and Juan Navarro of California.
Currently working with 2 families right now on a seperate breeding program to develop superior ro-genes (super genes within a bio-genetic family pool) that can consistently produce a high percentile of quality offsprings as prescribed by Pensom & McCully.
{P.S.} The reason I might sound prickish to you is because some do the cowboy rodeo/ nascar race car/ hunter sportsman thing while others like to hang out in gyms pumping iron and also sit front row and watch the NBA slam dunk contest.
I'm from the inner-city of northern California so you get the point right? Look... let's cut out the name calling because I'm a human being just like you (which means I sure in the hell ain't perfect). We may live in different parts of the USA... but we both eat, sleep, shit and like good Birmingham roller pigeons... correct?
Take care and wishing you and your loved ones much peace & prosperity for many generations to come.
10 - 4 Over and out!
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on Mar 29, 2008 4:19 PM
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DeepSpinLofts
41 posts
Apr 08, 2007
10:44 AM
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Scott... you da man!
I'm just a fella who likes anabolic muscle stimulants and good booze. What the heck do I know? I might have a mess of tumblers compared to pro's like you & Jerry Higgins.... he... he... he...
Deep Spin to win dog!
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on Jan 15, 2008 4:22 PM
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Newflyer
102 posts
Apr 08, 2007
2:48 PM
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HA HA HA.....Who is this Marcus guy??? And what planet did he drop in from??
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
1309 posts
Apr 08, 2007
4:17 PM
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Marcus, the two gents that I believe have the most competitive knowledge with the Hilton line would be John Destout and Jay Starley. I know that both would tell you the same thing, learn to manage them and cull very hard. John is a friend of mine and I've heard him say several times that he preferred a short, overactive spinner that was always chasing after the kit to bring some frequency to his birds. His philosophy may have changed now as his birds have progressed, but I believe that was a strong point for him and those birds at one time.
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DeepSpinLofts
43 posts
Apr 08, 2007
5:17 PM
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Hello MCCORMICKLOFTS
Now that's what I'm talkin about in regards to the recent addition of the 514 Hilton line to my loft.
This is what I call positive feedback:
===> "learn to manage them and cull very hard."
Thank you very much for the sound advice and do hope you and your loved ones are enjoying this Easter Sunday.
Take care....
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
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Missouri-Flyer
472 posts
Apr 08, 2007
6:22 PM
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Marcus,
I want to apoligize if my words made you feel like I was name calling. That wasn't the case, as I am not that type of person.
It sounds like you have the goods to compete with the rest.
You are right, being from different areas, tho still enjoying the same hobby is what makes these little birds so great.
I was kinda lost on the farmer/weight lifting stuff tho..LOL..I am both of those, and ride and race dirtbikes, yep even at my old age. I also am a water nutt, and ski, wakeboard,kneeboard, and believe it or not, this farmer is pretty good at it all.... :)..and nope, not much of a Nascar or NBA fan.
Hope you and your family have a wonderful day!
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Jerry
Home of "Whispering Wings Loft"
Last Edited by on Apr 08, 2007 6:27 PM
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DeepSpinLofts
45 posts
Apr 08, 2007
7:18 PM
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Hi there Jerry, it's really great to hear from you!
Here is my problem.
I would like to think that I can compete... but the problem is the places where I've been living.
I just lost a nice home in an upscale community because the housing committee there voted that either I get rid of my birds... or be forced to move.
As you can tell by my writings I still have my birds... so the hell with those folks. Me and the wife switched homes with the inlaws and its driving everybody nuts!
Her mother complains about the feathers in her yard... but so far the neighbors have been cool about my rollers. I lost 17 birds since I been here and breeding is a real drag due to living arrangements. Her parents said: "NO MORE BABIES"!
So I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place. Currently flying only 7 youngsters in which 2 show promise.
1) 2006 NBRC 1599R Black 2 odd White Flights Hen
2) 2007Jan NBRC 0794F Tortoise Shell 15 footer H style.
I'm hanging on for dear life with my spinners. For safe measurements... I have sent some rollers to a satellite loft in Oakland and also shipped off over 30 birds to a comrade in Baltimore Maryland who has been flying Norm Reed's family. Some of these satellite birds are from Borges/Kiser and some are good Hardesty/Reed mixes. But the bulk were pure (Black Country strain Plona's)
Hmmm....
Keepin my fingers crossed! I don't plan to make any real noise in the roller flys until Summer 2009. I'm patient, diligent, intelligent, steadfast and highly motivated to try and win it all someday.
Well it was great talking to you.
....and
Jerry..., may your camel carry so much precious gold across the desert... that it may break its hump. (smile)
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on May 23, 2007 3:31 AM
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nicksiders
1559 posts
Apr 08, 2007
7:24 PM
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Marcus,
Is that comrad in Baltimore David Awkward(sp?)?
Nick
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Snicker Rollers
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DeepSpinLofts
46 posts
Apr 09, 2007
5:11 AM
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Good morning Nick.....
And nope that's not my comrade.
Marcus
Deep Spin Lofts
Last Edited by on Feb 23, 2009 8:14 AM
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motherlodelofts
1693 posts
Apr 09, 2007
6:27 AM
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Kiser/Borges birds are pure Plona ? Marcus who did you get Kiser/Borges birds from ?
Scott
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maxspin
77 posts
Apr 09, 2007
11:39 AM
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Here is what I think of when someone says "Champion"……
It is word that they write on the pedigree when they want to add 000's to the price of the birds they are selling.
Keith
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Hector Coya
150 posts
Apr 09, 2007
3:58 PM
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Marcus
Hey bud ,your getting too tiqunical,just have fun with the birds,One of the best kits ive seen last year was from a guy that just started,he got his birds from the Pet Shot and (ALMOST) kicked everyone in the CPRC "S Butt, His name is Fred Jackens from Pomona,
Hes got no family backgroung on his birds,he got them from everyone, but they kick but.
hes been scoreing about 400 points in diferent clubs he flys.
Hector Coya
Last Edited by on Apr 09, 2007 4:29 PM
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Skylineloft
31 posts
Apr 09, 2007
4:05 PM
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Thats a great story Hector...lol
Have you seen the guys birds ?
Ray
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